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So I did something tonight...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scotchyscotch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 February 2013 at 10:14pm
I think I'm probably the aforementioned enabler . Me and my friend are both at a stage were we know it's T total from now on though.

However I have found myself drinking with him after a spell of sobriety thinking that it was important that he know he can have a social drink without it getting out of hand. I now know this isn't how this thing really works.

I suppose I just wanted to say that it's not always bad friends that make bad decisions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kayback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 12:27am
I agree I've always felt it's way too easy for other people to say you should drink but never stand by your decision not to.

Fortunately I've always set myself up as 1) the designated driver, so I always have an excuse 2)my work required no alcohol 12 hours before shift. This has been reduced to 8 though, but it was always easy to "blame" work when I didn't want to drink, and people always respected that. If it is "forced" on you, you're still good to go in their books and they don't try get you to drink.

Maybe come up with a reason not to that isn't your choice?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote impulse418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 2:38am
I had a huge fear of telling people I quit drinking. For the fact that they might say "Why? You don't have a problem" But about 98% of the people I told I quit drinking, responded with " Really? Good for you Colin!".

Then it hit me like a ton of bricks of how people really recognized the progression I had made. Long before I ever did. I only had 1 drinking friend tell me, " Well if you just went to college with me, you wouldn't be a alcoholic, just a college student haha...."

My drinking buddies were the last ones I told that I quit drinking, because in the beginning I had what they call reservations. 1 foot in sobriety, while 1 foot was in my old life style. Now, I have no problem telling anyone that I don't drink. If they ask why, I will respond a in a few different ways, my favorite being. "I'm allergic to alcohol" They usually stare and say really? Then I lay out the punchline " I break out in handcuffs" Usually gets a good laugh, whether it's genuine or nervous. If people keep asking questions (which is rare), I'll flat out tell them I'm a recovering alcoholic. I don't do this because I feel obligated. But for the fact that they might know someone who has a problem, or they themselves think they have a problem. And that they will ask, or remember down the road, someone (me) who use to get in trouble drinking, and found a way out.

A lot of suggestions were thrown at me early in my sobriety to help me abstain. Like what other people have mention,change my playground and playmates. It was very easy to quit hanging out at the bar, and with strictly drinking buddies. But when it came to social events, and friends I had since grade school. It was a little more precarious. I had to become grounded enough in my program, loooong before I was ready to be around drinking. Now, I have no problem being around it, as long as my intentions are pure. Am I there to enjoy the company of my fellow friends, or something else? Am I there to display tomy friends, who could probably slow down or quit drinking, that it is possible to have fun without drinking? When people get in trouble, is when they hang out at a old stomping grounds, to get a "contact" high from the atmosphere. What they really want, is the chaos that comes along with bars and excessive drinking. Like in the movie Changing Lanes with Samuel Jackson and Ben Affleck. Jackson is sober, but is involved with some serious chaos that lands him in jail. His sponsor (guide) comes and bails him out. His sponsor starts ripping him a new one, wondering why he was playing stupid games. Jackson replies " But I didn't drink, isn't that the point?!". His sponsor calmly replies, "You know what, you aren't even addicted to alcohol, you are addicted to chaos"

In early sobriety, I would mistaken serenity for boredom. And when I was bored back in the day, I would drink. Nothing more exciting than that. When I got sober, I no longer wanted THAT much chaos, but just a little, to you know, have "fun". So I was doing all kinds of crazy crap, like speeding on the freeway, to a slew of other things. Which were all making my life unmanageable. Now a days, I love serenity, and don't take it for granted. But, I still like chaos, just in smaller doses. For example I work at a detox facility. Which has plenty of somewhat controlled chaos. But the nice thing is, once I punch out, I leave it at work.

I'm definitely not a saint, but this way of life is all about progress, not perfection.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote choopie911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 4:13am
Originally posted by scotchyscotch scotchyscotch wrote:

However I have found myself drinking with him after a spell of sobriety thinking that it was important that he know he can have a social drink without it getting out of hand. I now know this isn't how this thing really works.


This is something I hate about alcoholism/ addiction, is that it owns you even long after you're not doing it anymore. I mean, returning to "normal" would be being able to have a beer or two/ wine or two over dinner, or a few during a poker night, or whatever your thing is. But alcoholism seems to destroy that ability, that it's all or nothing. It's always a far better decision to go without, alcohol is hard on you, but losing its social value is a shame.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kayback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 4:47am
I do think there is a difference between being an alcoholic and drinking too much.

Maybe splitting hairs and the like, but not being able to function without alcohol in your life and partying too hard are rather different tracks. I know I used to drink WAY too much for what is healthy, but in the same vein I eat too much junk food and sugars than is healthy now so what's really the difference?

Getting blotto every weekend because you are out partying may mean you need to adjust your recreational events.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote choopie911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 5:01am
Originally posted by Kayback Kayback wrote:

I do think there is a difference between being an alcoholic and drinking too much.

Maybe splitting hairs and the like, but not being able to function without alcohol in your life and partying too hard are rather different tracks. I know I used to drink WAY too much for what is healthy, but in the same vein I eat too much junk food and sugars than is healthy now so what's really the difference?

Getting blotto every weekend because you are out partying may mean you need to adjust your recreational events.

KBK

Agreed
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote impulse418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 5:19am
Originally posted by Kayback Kayback wrote:

I do think there is a difference between being an alcoholic and drinking too much.

Maybe splitting hairs and the like, but not being able to function without alcohol in your life and partying too hard are rather different tracks. I know I used to drink WAY too much for what is healthy, but in the same vein I eat too much junk food and sugars than is healthy now so what's really the difference?

Getting blotto every weekend because you are out partying may mean you need to adjust your recreational events.

KBK


There is a difference between hard drinkers, and alcoholics. A commonly used humerous example is this. There are two drunks in a holding cell, both got DUIs. The hard drinker is saying to himself " Why did I drink so much, I knew better than that, and was even stupider to drive." The alcoholic is having a similar conversation, but slightly different " Man... why did I take the freeway"

I was mostly a binge drinker, I never became physically addicted to alcohol. But I now realize I was an alcoholic long before I picked up my first drink.

I will copy and paste some definitions, but our internet is extremely slow right now, and can't even open a PDF file.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote impulse418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 5:23am
Originally posted by choopie911 choopie911 wrote:

Originally posted by scotchyscotch scotchyscotch wrote:

However I have found myself drinking with him after a spell of sobriety thinking that it was important that he know he can have a social drink without it getting out of hand. I now know this isn't how this thing really works.


This is something I hate about alcoholism/ addiction, is that it owns you even long after you're not doing it anymore. I mean, returning to "normal" would be being able to have a beer or two/ wine or two over dinner, or a few during a poker night, or whatever your thing is. But alcoholism seems to destroy that ability, that it's all or nothing. It's always a far better decision to go without, alcohol is hard on you, but losing its social value is a shame.


Alcohol is a great social lubricant, for those who are moderate/social drinkers. But in reality, if I were to pick any disease to have. This is the one I would choose hands down. Compared to cancer, Parkinson's, dementia etc etc.
Talk about diseases that own you. Makes one grateful.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stratoaxe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 3:09pm
Originally posted by impulse impulse wrote:

In early sobriety, I would mistaken serenity for boredom. And when I was bored back in the day, I would drink. Nothing more exciting than that. When I got sober, I no longer wanted THAT much chaos, but just a little, to you know, have "fun". So I was doing all kinds of crazy crap, like speeding on the freeway, to a slew of other things. Which were all making my life unmanageable. Now a days, I love serenity, and don't take it for granted. But, I still like chaos, just in smaller doses. For example I work at a detox facility. Which has plenty of somewhat controlled chaos. But the nice thing is, once I punch out, I leave it at work.
Man, I can completely relate to this. I've got so bored the past two or three days I get what I call "boredom headaches." It's like my brain is on fire. So I've run about 300 miles on my car in two weeks just driving and wasting gas.
It's funny, I'll sit and do absolutely nothing because everything sounds dull and boring in my mind without alcohol, but the minute I start doing something (watching TV, reading, video games, etc) I feel fine.
 
I think it's why I never drink during school. I always have something to do.

Originally posted by impulse impulse wrote:

Alcohol is a great social lubricant, for those who are moderate/social drinkers. But in reality, if I were to pick any disease to have. This is the one I would choose hands down. Compared to cancer, Parkinson's, dementia etc etc.
Talk about diseases that own you. Makes one grateful.
 
For sure. That's why I generally stop short of calling it a disease-a cancer patient didn't choose their disease, it chose them. I have a symbiotic relationship with alcohol-I feed off of it and it destroys me. I love alcohol and the high it gives and that's what keeps me coming back.
 
Originally posted by Kayback Kayback wrote:

Maybe splitting hairs and the like, but not being able to function without alcohol in your life and partying too hard are rather different tracks. I know I used to drink WAY too much for what is healthy, but in the same vein I eat too much junk food and sugars than is healthy now so what's really the difference?
 
Here's a test I've come up with to tell if you're binge-a-holic like myself. Go to a restaurant and order a mixed drink with your meal. What happens next?

If you say you finish your meal and maybe order another one then congrats-you're a social drinker. If, however, I do that-I get a headache. It's like I've started a puzzle and it's now sitting half empty in my mind. The margarita has now become the focal point of the meal and frankly the food is meaningless to me at that point.
 
When I go eat with my parents, I specifically pick places that serve mixed drinks and I ride with them. My binge drinking is planned long before I start, even if I don't realize I'm doing it. When I get there, I don't look over the menu. Typically I order a Patron margarita and  talk the waitress into making it just slightly stronger. Food-meaningless. Seriously, I'll order fish tacos and not finish all 3 of them yet run up a 50 dollar tab in margaritas.
 
Any other restaurant, I'll order Jagerbombs at noon. Seriously, I've learned to equate eating out with drinking.
 
The other thing I've noticed that scares me is that I can't talk to people when I'm sober. I tend to be slightly grumpy and antisocial and people piss me off for no reason. I have great long conversations after a couple of beers and I start opening up emotionally to people.
 
I'm really glad I'm single right now-I'd hate to know what a girlfriend would feel like in this situation.
 
The good news is I'm 3 days down and feel pretty good. I've got a pretty good game plan-just wiping alcohol out of my planning. I've let all my friends know that I won't be drinking, making up stories to the more skeptical ones about school or liver problems, ulcers, etc etc. I figure if they think it's a medical reason they won't push me with it.
 
I've learned that it's silly to make absolute statements when it comes to addictions. Saying "I'll never take another drink again" is overly optimistic and, at least for me, it's much better to break it up in to small accomplishments than try to tackle the whole thing at one time.
 
As far as beer as a social tool-the good news is that I REALLY hate beer (it's a quantity versus reward problem for me-I get way bloated and sick before I actually get drunk) so a trip to the flying saucer usually lands me with a 6 dollar glass of imported beer that I'll sip all night and leave for the bartender. As long as I'm with people that aren't hard partiers I can generally handle drinking a single beer and moving on with my day.
 
A shot, on the other hand, will pretty much end with me blacking out or else being very grumpy.
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kayback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 5:49pm
Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:


As far as beer as a social tool-the good news is that I REALLY hate beer (it's a quantity versus reward problem for me-I get way bloated and sick before I actually get drunk)


Yup me too. Hate the stuff.

Remind me how old are you? I forget who's who in this zoo sometimes.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote choopie911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 5:58pm
Originally posted by impulse418 impulse418 wrote:


Originally posted by choopie911 choopie911 wrote:

Originally posted by scotchyscotch scotchyscotch wrote:

However I have found myself drinking with him after a spell of sobriety thinking that it was important that he know he can have a social drink without it getting out of hand. I now know this isn't how this thing really works.


This is something I hate about alcoholism/ addiction, is that it owns you even long after you're not doing it anymore. I mean, returning to "normal" would be being able to have a beer or two/ wine or two over dinner, or a few during a poker night, or whatever your thing is. But alcoholism seems to destroy that ability, that it's all or nothing. It's always a far better decision to go without, alcohol is hard on you, but losing its social value is a shame.


Alcohol is a great social lubricant, for those who are moderate/social drinkers. But in reality, if I were to pick any disease to have. This is the one I would choose hands down. Compared to cancer, Parkinson's, dementia etc etc.
Talk about diseases that own you. Makes one grateful.


I've never heard that perspective on that issue before, that's a really good viewpoint. I'll have to try to remember that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stratoaxe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 6:44pm
Originally posted by Kayback Kayback wrote:

Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:


As far as beer as a social tool-the good news is that I REALLY hate beer (it's a quantity versus reward problem for me-I get way bloated and sick before I actually get drunk)


Yup me too. Hate the stuff.

Remind me how old are you? I forget who's who in this zoo sometimes.

KBK

Physically? 26.
 
Mentally? 12.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote impulse418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 February 2013 at 9:00pm
Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:

Originally posted by impulse impulse wrote:

In early sobriety, I would mistaken serenity for boredom. And when I was bored back in the day, I would drink. Nothing more exciting than that. When I got sober, I no longer wanted THAT much chaos, but just a little, to you know, have "fun". So I was doing all kinds of crazy crap, like speeding on the freeway, to a slew of other things. Which were all making my life unmanageable. Now a days, I love serenity, and don't take it for granted. But, I still like chaos, just in smaller doses. For example I work at a detox facility. Which has plenty of somewhat controlled chaos. But the nice thing is, once I punch out, I leave it at work.
Man, I can completely relate to this. I've got so bored the past two or three days I get what I call "boredom headaches." It's like my brain is on fire. So I've run about 300 miles on my car in two weeks just driving and wasting gas.
It's funny, I'll sit and do absolutely nothing because everything sounds dull and boring in my mind without alcohol, but the minute I start doing something (watching TV, reading, video games, etc) I feel fine.
 
I think it's why I never drink during school. I always have something to do.

Originally posted by impulse impulse wrote:

Alcohol is a great social lubricant, for those who are moderate/social drinkers. But in reality, if I were to pick any disease to have. This is the one I would choose hands down. Compared to cancer, Parkinson's, dementia etc etc.
Talk about diseases that own you. Makes one grateful.
 
For sure. That's why I generally stop short of calling it a disease-a cancer patient didn't choose their disease, it chose them. I have a symbiotic relationship with alcohol-I feed off of it and it destroys me. I love alcohol and the high it gives and that's what keeps me coming back.

It was a extreme example, but true the none less. For me, only speaking for me, I never chose alcoholism. I did choose to drink, but never to have a allergy of the body that made me drink to oblivion.
 
Originally posted by Kayback Kayback wrote:

Maybe splitting hairs and the like, but not being able to function without alcohol in your life and partying too hard are rather different tracks. I know I used to drink WAY too much for what is healthy, but in the same vein I eat too much junk food and sugars than is healthy now so what's really the difference?
 
Here's a test I've come up with to tell if you're binge-a-holic like myself. Go to a restaurant and order a mixed drink with your meal. What happens next?

If you say you finish your meal and maybe order another one then congrats-you're a social drinker. If, however, I do that-I get a headache. It's like I've started a puzzle and it's now sitting half empty in my mind. The margarita has now become the focal point of the meal and frankly the food is meaningless to me at that point.
 
When I go eat with my parents, I specifically pick places that serve mixed drinks and I ride with them. My binge drinking is planned long before I start, even if I don't realize I'm doing it. When I get there, I don't look over the menu. Typically I order a Patron margarita and  talk the waitress into making it just slightly stronger. Food-meaningless. Seriously, I'll order fish tacos and not finish all 3 of them yet run up a 50 dollar tab in margaritas.

A couple of great observations. It looks like you have taken a pretty honest look at yourself.
 
Any other restaurant, I'll order Jagerbombs at noon. Seriously, I've learned to equate eating out with drinking.
 
The other thing I've noticed that scares me is that I can't talk to people when I'm sober. I tend to be slightly grumpy and antisocial and people piss me off for no reason. I have great long conversations after a couple of beers and I start opening up emotionally to people.
 
I'm really glad I'm single right now-I'd hate to know what a girlfriend would feel like in this situation.
 
The good news is I'm 3 days down and feel pretty good. I've got a pretty good game plan-just wiping alcohol out of my planning. I've let all my friends know that I won't be drinking, making up stories to the more skeptical ones about school or liver problems, ulcers, etc etc. I figure if they think it's a medical reason they won't push me with it.
 
I've learned that it's silly to make absolute statements when it comes to addictions. Saying "I'll never take another drink again" is overly optimistic and, at least for me, it's much better to break it up in to small accomplishments than try to tackle the whole thing at one time.

One day at a time. Or 1 hour at a time, or even 1 minute at a time. When people ask me how long I have been sober, I tell them since the time I woke up today. Because what I did yesterday won't help me today, and thinking tomorrow won't help right now.
 
As far as beer as a social tool-the good news is that I REALLY hate beer (it's a quantity versus reward problem for me-I get way bloated and sick before I actually get drunk) so a trip to the flying saucer usually lands me with a 6 dollar glass of imported beer that I'll sip all night and leave for the bartender. As long as I'm with people that aren't hard partiers I can generally handle drinking a single beer and moving on with my day.
 
A shot, on the other hand, will pretty much end with me blacking out or else being very grumpy.
 
 
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