Edumacate me on AR15's

I'd love a smith and wesson, but the sporter models they sell here don't have chrome-lined barrels. 

Cabellas and Gander Mountain seem to have the S&Ws for around $1k.

I get what you're saying KBK, but also just in the first stages of even looking at these. Its one of the reasons I asked for some resources to be able to get an idea of where to even go. I have very little info from people around me and figured some of people here would be a good place to at least get an idea of where to look. I know my brother has done some research, but he tends to get very tunnel visioned about things and while he will research the heck out of things before he makes a decision, he still makes very odd decisions sometimes. I'm cheap, but would rather have a solid plain Jane better built ___ than a fancy, flashy POS ____.. You can always add flash, if you have a solid core.

I don't think supply will meet demand before an executive order to ban "evil black rifles" takes place. Find a lower first, but it might be an uphill battle getting one at a decent price.

Colt do not have bad weapons. They are totally top tier. Especially when you are talking about the M4 or .mil spec. The only guys who have the Technical Data Package for building M4's are Colt and FN Hershal. Everyone else, even the good ones, are doing it by ear.

A current Colt will have the correct heat treatment, will have properly staked parts that need staking, will be properly in "spec". The whole "Colt diminishing" is a myth akin to "M16's jam all the time". It simply isn't true.

Like Impulse said, LWRC, Knights Arms, Noveske, BCM, Colt and Daniel Defense are all solid working guns. Even DD had some issued this past year that let some customers down.

Rock River, Stag, Olympic, DPMS, DelTron, Bushmaster, Black Rain and a bunch of other makers all make hobby guns.

GO ask the guys who run them. Pat Rogers for one runs BCM's pretty much exclusively in his classes. He is very free with the info on what performs to standard and what dies. All his after course reports which had hobby guns in the mix mostly had the hobby guns breaking in them. Simply fact. If you shoot a LOT, the hobby guns will fail at a faster rate than the more reliable fighting guns.

It is all in what you need. I only need a rifle capable of a couple of hundred rounds a year. It is all I can afford. So a hobby gun will fit me needs.

Get the right tool for the job.

Buy whichever AR you think you need, but put some thought into it. Also, do proper research. A PB forum isn't it. Be aware that you can end up paying for a DPMS almost as much as a decent manufacturer.

Get an Aimpoint H-1, a Surefire Fury Defender or EAG version in a decent mount like the Viking Tactics and call it a day.

KBK

PS S&W also make more or less hobby guns, but they are on the upper scale of hobby guns.

KBK

impulse418 wrote: Buy a SCAR, and be done with it. If you still want the AR platform. LWRC and Knight Arms. Buy once, cry once.

Quickly googled SCAR prices and most of what I am seeing is $2k +. Aint gonna happen.

Buy a SCAR, and be done with it.

If you still want the AR platform. LWRC and Knight Arms. Buy once, cry once.

I can't tell you how Bushmaster's quality is, I'll get a strike.

All in all there are two very separate forms of AR 15 on the market. Working tools and range toys.

There are some good deals to be had if you know what to look for and if you buy the right tool for the job. The hobby guns, $600 guns and the built it yourself ones are more or less all in the same bracket, however you can sometimes end up paying just as much for a hobby level gun as you will for a fighting gun.

If you want a tough as nails, die hard gun that'll see you through the end times, get something from Colt, BCM or a couple of other manufacturers.

A hobby gun is great for a couple of mags per trip to the range. For classes with round counts in the 1500 region you're going to need something better.

If you want a fighting gun, go look at a couple of websites run by fighting men, not hobby shooters.

You'll probably end up paying a wee bit more, but not always.....

KBK

evillepaintball wrote: How's bushmaster quality these days?

From what I've seen, better. Windham is making some nice looking rifles using their old tooling and employees.

My recommendation?

Step 1: Buy an already assembled Bushmaster M-4.


Step 2: Add enough accessories that you've now negated any weight benefits the M-4 design has to offer.

Step 3: Go to the range and compare your level of tacticool as opposed to the 19 year old next to you. Be sure to point out that your flashlight / flare launcher combo cost more than his optics and snicker smugly

Step 4: Realize that you've bought a grown man's Barbie doll and trade it immediately for an M1A.

Step 5: Tell your wife that the phase is over and she can come back.