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Vee Pee Debate Prediction Thread

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 10:33pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

This moderator is a joke...


This.

I predict the moderator's behavior will be fodder for at least several years worth of liberal media accusations.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 10:37pm
As I posted on facebook...

‎"Watch out middle class the tax bill is coming to YOU". Ryan wins debate with one line...
They tremble at my name...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote usafpilot07 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 10:40pm
Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:


Originally posted by usafpilot07 usafpilot07 wrote:

Biden is a smug asshole.


It feels like he wants to start a lot of his tangents with "Look, kid . . . " 


I kept waiting for him to call Ryan "chief" or "sport."

Really though, taking into account I don't agree with his politics and that he got away with too much interruption, I thought Biden handled his talking points pretty well. It will, however, be very interesting to see how the smirk/laughing/etc. play in the polls tomorrow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 10:44pm
A nuclear armed Iran is a laughing matter to old joe... Seriously...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 10:49pm
Originally posted by usafpilot07 usafpilot07 wrote:


Really though, taking into account I don't agree with his politics and that he got away with too much interruption, I thought Biden handled his talking points pretty well.
 

I wonder how much of Biden being Biden in this was to make up for Obama's sort of reserved presence in the first debate? I also wonder if that's even possible -- it'd take some assumption that Biden listens to his handlers. 

I agree with you, though. He stuck to the party points -- well, both did -- and I think he walked away pretty OK. Ryan did as well, although I think Biden had the upper-hand on the foreign policy and social/domestic issues, whereas Ryan's calm and collection during the economic stuff made him come off better. 


Quote It will, however, be very interesting to see how the smirk/laughing/etc. play in the polls tomorrow.

True. I think so much of the VP debate is simply to wind up the base for the final weeks, as you rarely hear anything groundbreaking. 


Edited by agentwhale007 - 11 October 2012 at 10:51pm
"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stratoaxe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 10:50pm
Originally posted by usafpilot07 usafpilot07 wrote:

Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:


Originally posted by usafpilot07 usafpilot07 wrote:

Biden is a smug asshole.


It feels like he wants to start a lot of his tangents with "Look, kid . . . " 


I kept waiting for him to call Ryan "chief" or "sport."

Really though, taking into account I don't agree with his politics and that he got away with too much interruption, I thought Biden handled his talking points pretty well. It will, however, be very interesting to see how the smirk/laughing/etc. play in the polls tomorrow.
 
I think that they said very little in their time. I still believe that Biden won the debate as far as "winning" goes, but I don't think either of them forwarded or reversed their respective cause.

Overall I was pretty disappointed, I think the whole debate played off like a PBS discussion panel-a couple of disgruntled old people arguing economics around a coffee cup.

Oh well, on to presidential debate #2 I suppose.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stratoaxe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 10:53pm
Originally posted by Whale Whale wrote:


I wonder how much of Biden being Biden in this was to make up for Obama's sort of reserved presence in the first debate? I also wonder if that's even possible -- it'd take some assumption that Biden listens to his handlers. 


I mentioned that to my friend earlier. It seemed like Biden was artificially producing a kind of compensatory outrage. I think had he toned that down and given Ryan a chance to talk he could have allowed him to hang himself. As it stands I think the format was too loose and unprofessional to pull a real political win for either side.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lightningbolt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 11:05pm
In fact, to me sifting through lies is just a waste of time. I think ryan will come out on top in the polls based on body language, demeanor and palatable presentation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 11:14pm
I was shocked that biden doubled down on the stupid "youtube" video being the cause of the embassy attack... when everyone is trying to distance themselves from that...

Guess he didn't get the memo. Or maybe he just believes the lie?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 11:19pm
Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:

 I think had he toned that down and given Ryan a chance to talk he could have allowed him to hang himself.

The depressant his handler sprinkled in his pre-debate oatmeal finally kicked in somewhere before foreign policy. 
"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lightningbolt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 11:25pm
Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:


Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:

 I think had he toned that down and given Ryan a chance to talk he could have allowed him to hang himself.


The depressant his handler sprinkled in his pre-debate oatmeal finally kicked in somewhere before foreign policy. 

i was thinking something along the same lines
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 October 2012 at 11:33pm
They tremble at my name...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote choopie911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 October 2012 at 2:41am
Haha I was just googling stuff in relation to this thread and stumbled across this photo, which has made my night:

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 October 2012 at 8:18am
yeah, Time magazine pulling outtake pictures from an interview in the past and using them to try and hurt Ryan. 

Shocking... It is what the liberal media DOES... Just like the AP who put the picture out of Romney and the little girl... Nothing like media bias that is plain as day. 


This "exchange" summed up the debate. 



Biden came off extremely rude, and wouldn't let Ryan talk without interrupting him. And when he didn't like what Ryan said that proved him wrong, he strawmanned. 

Ryan didn't say he was Kennedy, he was giving examples that if you tax something MORE you get LESS of it...

And biden as a hardcore leftist, doesn't want to see reality, so he attacks something in his own mind that didn't happen...

The public doesn't like that. And the poll numbers will prove that fact. I'm sure hardcore leftists loved the debate, as that is all they have, being rude and needing a liberal media to "fact" check their stories. 

We all know the democrats couldn't afford another debate blunder. So the media will do their best to propagandize that Biden won. And yet, the polls will tell a different story, as the only people who would like bidens "performance" are hardcore MSNBC far left liberals who live in a strange "liberality" in their minds. 

Obama will raise taxes on the middle class to pay for their massive no budget spending spree, that is the most expensive in world history, and they can't even keep up with PRINTING as much money as they are spending...

Romney will slow down spending, (not what I would want, but a middle of the road call) I think we need to cut the federal government in half or more...

The country likes the middle, and biden proved that the Obama/biden ticket is far left, while the Romney/ryan ticket is middle of the road...


The state of the world AND our economy is no laughing matter... Unless you are a far left liberal I guess.



Edited by FreeEnterprise - 12 October 2012 at 8:47am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TRAVELER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 October 2012 at 9:15am
It's all a load of malarkey! The worst thing for me tonight was the realization that if something were to happen to Obama, Biden could actually become president of the USA. Biden reminds me a bit of the old President Johnson, except that Johnson was born with a brain. I would vote for Romney if only for the sake of never having to hear the words "welcome President Biden". 

The debate was nonsense, and is irrelevant. Neither man will change anyone's opinions in any meaningful way. Biden did a little better than I expected, as did Ryan. I didn't expect much from the moderator, and I wasn't disappointed. No on will feel any differently tomorrow than they did today. 

The next two debates between Obama and Romney will be more convincing to many people. 

Now I am living in Tokyo, and I have been working in the financial industry here. Most people here like Obama, they think he looks good and acts cool (cool is important in Japan), but few people want to see him as president for another 4 years. America has always been the engine which has driven the world's economies, and the current drivers of that engine couldn't find their backsides with both hands and a flashlight. 

The upcoming election has a lot at stake, not just for America, but for Europe and Japan as well. The last 4 years have been murky, with no meaningful leadership from America of any kind. Vast amounts of stimulus money has been spent to "jumpstart" the economy, but most of this money has been given to the states, which in turn have used the money to pay their government workers. Almost none of this money has made it to the private sector. The public sector does employ many, but it generates no net revenue for the government. 

Unemployment went down last week, but only because 800,000 new government jobs were "created". There was nearly no growth in the private sector. In real world numbers, government workers would not be considered in an employment poll, once again, because they generate no net revenue to the economy. For each public sector job, there should be at least 25 private sector jobs. These private sector jobs generate enough tax revenue to pay for the public sector workers. 

The rest of the stimulus has been the printing of money, which the government has used to buy it's own bonds, which devalues the currency, making gas, food, and everything more expensive to ordinary people. 

Obama said during his debate that his administration had "reduced the deficit by one trillion dollars". Deficit and debt have two different meanings. When he said he "reduced the deficit" it means that projected spending was reduced, not that any actual money was saved or recovered. In his first term in office, Obama has added more money to the debt than all the previous presidents combined, included Bush. At the moment, your family's share of this debt is $137,000. Any guess how much it might be the current president gets another 4 years to manage the economy?

I don't like Romney, but I dislike Obama even more. I think Obama is a good man, even an honest and well-meaning man, but he is a terrible president. 




Edited by TRAVELER - 12 October 2012 at 9:17am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldsoldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 October 2012 at 9:17am
Actually got bored watching it. Biden being the 'bully' in the room, interupting at leasure and then the smirk if Ryan interupted him at all.
Biden just droned on with the standard, yet proven wrong on so many levels Democrat economic plan. How can taking more from the private sector, and spending far more than you take in solve a economic issue already with a negative balance, and all you want to do is increase that negative balance. Again totally confiscating the wealth of those 150,000 extreme 'rich' families runs this administration and current government for what 98 days at current spending levels.

Biden on foriegn policy contridicting the current 'story line' of Libya from the administration was a real revealing moment.

Biden came off as rude and condensending, and the smirk and smile really showed another form or arrogance from Biden, combined with the Obama debate arrogance, and their popularity is dropping, how can that be, they are the smartest men in the room, or so they think.

Again another "Lessor of the two evils presented" election, and the majority will just decide who they hate more over real substance.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 October 2012 at 9:57am
Originally posted by TRAVELER TRAVELER wrote:

The next two debates between Obama and Romney will be more convincing to many people.
 

Yep. The VP debates historically don't do much unless one candidate is really out there, like Palin's winking. And even that didn't show a direct drop in the polls, it just brought up the questions about her into the light. 

Quote but most of this money has been given to the states, which in turn have used the money to pay their government workers.
 

I don't think you're using the word "most" in its correct intention. 

Quote Almost none of this money has made it to the private sector.
 

Ok, so let's assume that you were correct, that most of it simply "went to government workers," what did they do with it? 

Quote The public sector does employ many, but it generates no net revenue for the government.
 

That's largely not the intention of those jobs, either. 

Quote In real world numbers, government workers would not be considered in an employment poll, once again, because they generate no net revenue to the economy.
 

Whut?


Quote In his first term in office, Obama has added more money to the debt than all the previous presidents combined, included Bush.



"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 October 2012 at 9:59am
Originally posted by oldsoldier oldsoldier wrote:

 How can taking more from the private sector, and spending far more than you take in solve a economic issue already with a negative balance, and all you want to do is increase that negative balance.
 

Economics.

Quote Again totally confiscating the wealth of those 150,000 extreme 'rich' families runs this administration and current government for what 98 days at current spending levels.
 

Something nobody has proposed. 


"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldsoldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 October 2012 at 10:31am
Whale, just points not proposals. It's math, all the money from the 'rich' in this case, if 'confiscated' hypothetically.

And the economics classes I took as well as bussiness math emphisised that your income must be at least as great as your expendatures for any chance of success. Any time your income is less than your expendatures, it is economically a 'failure'. And yes we have been in faiure mode for the most part since around 1863 when the Civil War costs far more than was being taken in, and we just keep repeating the process with far greater consiquences each time.

I do hope you do not have a meltdown in November if and when Obama/Biden lose...which is looking more likely by the 'polls' Democrats were so fond of when thier candidate was on top, now there are not that important, strange. Personally I want the polls to show Obama just ahead, knowing human nature if the average Dem sees Obama in the lead they may go 'we are good' and not vote, more of a trend now than ever.

Edited by oldsoldier - 12 October 2012 at 10:34am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 October 2012 at 10:40am
Originally posted by oldsoldier oldsoldier wrote:

Whale, just points not proposals.
 

I hear ya. I enjoy chatting about this stuff, and I don't have to go in for office hours until 1 p.m. (My students are working on their first-ever news stories, so I'm expecting the HEEELP brigade to hit early and often) so I've got time to chat through some stuff. 

Quote It's math,
 

Ehh. I think country-wide economics are almost always going to be too big to smush down into simple math (Something both sides have been doing lately). 

Quote  if 'confiscated' hypothetically.
 

Confiscated in what sense? 

Quote And the economics classes I took as well as bussiness math emphisised that your income must be at least as great as your expendatures for any chance of success.
 

But I think this goes back to the idea that running a country based on simple business math doesn't really work. 

I think that if this analogy was correct -- the one that keeps getting kicked around -- then anyone with a mortgage would be incorrect for spending anything, ever. A mortgage is, after all, a given actor being quite a bit in the economic hole on paper for a very long time. But, it's a forward investment. By taking out a mortgage, it allows you to have a home so that, even at its most simple concept, you have a place to live in order to have a job. It also creates asset. 

Quote Any time your income is less than your expendatures, it is economically a 'failure'. And yes we have been in faiure mode for the most part since around 1863 when the Civil War costs far more than was being taken in, and we just keep repeating the process with far greater consiquences each time.

I'm just not quite sure a country of our size could ever possibly do anything -- especially not exist on the global scale -- without using a forward deficit and debt. 
"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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