Todd Akin

Whale wrote: I think that there needs to be a serious dialogue in the U.S. about rape and rape culture. The really grotesque thing about Akin's statement was the "legitimate rape," as if there are forms of rape that are somehow less legitimate. To me, it speaks to the heap of misconceptions this country has about rape -- that it mostly occurs by strangers leaping out of bushes at night, that the victim is at fault for any aspect of a rape, that the majority of rapes are violent acts, etc.

100% agreed.

Rape statistics are an eye opener. My sociology professor spent a lot of time on real vs perceived trends in rape and I realized that I knew next nothing on the subject. The trouble with rape in this country is that we're very hush hush about it. People like Akin make it seem like rape is simply a way for women to get back at men or a way to get pity.

By PA law, yes, that is rape.  However, the confusion could come from differing state and local definitions of rape.  Some statutes require that the 2 people be of differing gender, some define it as only vaginal intercourse, etc.  

oldsoldier wrote: http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/senator-famous-joking-about-rape-campaigns-obama-

weeklystandard.com wrote: The requested page could not be found.

So now were tryIng to discredit Obama by using jokes a comedian ,who probably shouldn't have been elected in the first place, said as a comedian?

That's like trying to discredit Obama if he ever stood on a stage with Arnold Schwarzenegger for all the people that he "killed"

Edited by jmac3 - 23 August 2012 at 8:24pm

impulse418 wrote: It's sad how easy it is to side track republicans during election year. We get it, you don't like abortions, contraceptives, etc etc. But why do you people go out of your way to alienate yourself from the female vote, every election. It's like clock work.

It's because fringe dwellers always get the media coverage. It's like that in every party.

This is an especially awkward position because while his reasoning is different he shares a platform with other Republicans. So they can't just be like "screw that guy he's a loon." Its the reason I've been pissing and moaning about the tea party all along-eventually they're going to be the face of the Republicans. It's just how public perception works.

It's the same reason thoughts of Obama bring to mind Muslims, Africa, and dirty Chicago politics. Cognitive recognition is a funny thing, we remember and associate people by their most extreme characteristics, even if those attributes are based on unfounded accusations.

Remember how Mama Cass totally choked to death on a ham sandwich?

Edited by stratoaxe - 23 August 2012 at 10:22pm

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To be fair, he wasn't THAT far off base, medically speaking, but he definitely worded it wrong. The vagina is a hostile space for sperm and already makes it pretty damn hard for conception. On top of that, if a female is under a lot of stress (such as marital issues, job issues, and yes, rape among other things) it manifests itself physiologically and can in turn make the body less receptive to conception, let alone carrying to term. Of course not impossible.






And to comment on whales post about news refusing to release supposed victims names... the news is also quick to jump on releasing the accused name and address, quickly making it a "She said it happened, so he HAD to have done it" situation, despite the decent percentage of accusations that turn out to be false. It's not an equal playing ground and makes it that much harder for the falsely accused. Just like the general idea that people don't view acquaintance rape as 'real rape', they also view "Well no one would lie about that" and label the accused as guilty.

Edited by Linus - 24 August 2012 at 12:23am

agentwhale007 wrote: While reporting on an arrest, the story does almost always include the name of the person charged - because that's the actual fact of what happened. It's not a judgement as to the person actually committing the crime, but simply a statement of fact

When people see "The rape victim, who we will not name, stated Mr Peterson raped her"... the average person will view the anonymous accuser as the victim and the named person as the one who did it, without any further proof. You may write the name due to the arrest, but the average person views the arrest as "Well, they must have done it or they wouldn't have been arrested"

The number of rapes that are never reported because of threat of violence, or because the victim doesn't know what rape is defined as, or for myriad other reasons, is astonishingly high. [/URL]

I'd say the rate of false allegations and convictions based off those is horrendous. Depending on the study, it usually averages in the teens, with the FBIs official number at 8%. That's 4 times the national average of unfounded accusations in all other crimes (at 2%). That's just the number that is found out, some experts believe a much higher number.

Edited by Linus - 24 August 2012 at 12:54am

For sure false accusations happen, and I do believe that penalties should be crazy severe for doing so. I think the lines of rape become especially blurry with statutory rape. But that's a well discussed topic with a fairly common consensus.

But my issue with this guy lies strictly in his delivery. It's like people who quite crime statistics all among minorities in conversations about race relations. Are they there? Yup. But when used the wrong way in a conversation it's like portraying then as lesser forms of humanity instead of examine the socioeconomic factors behind the statistics.

So while you may be 100% correct that a woman has a harder time conceiving under stress, the way this man used that fact was to cast doubt on a majority of cases.

agentwhale007 wrote: I'm sure that can happen, but what exactly is the news media supposed to do? Not state the available facts? Where does that end, exactly?

If you're going to state the available facts, then state ALL the availble facts instead of cherrypicking. How about releasing both names instead? If you release the accused name and they're later acquitted or it's found out it was falsified, you can't undo the damage that was done by putting that name out in public. If you're acquitted and records are expunged, the court documents will be unavailable, but a prospective employer doing Google search will see you were accused, charged for rape.   You hardly ever see the news articals about acquittals, pretty much only if it's high-profile or special interest.


And yes, you can argue that it's public record which is why you can do the accused name and that the public can look up the accusers name if they want, but you know people won't do that.


I hate when the media uses "We want to respect the privacy of the accuser" but don't give a damn about the accused when they can be just as innocent, if not more so.

agentwhale007 wrote: Even so, even if the 8 percent are indeed false, despite that number most likely being incorrect, we're talking about studies and polls that consistently show that at least half of all rapes are underreported, with that number growing exponentially on college campuses.

I really don't want to go back several years of forum posts, but aren't you of the mind that it's better to have 10 criminals go free than 1 innocent go to jail?

stratoaxe wrote: So while you may be 100% correct that a woman has a harder time conceiving under stress, the way this man used that fact was to cast doubt on a majority of cases.

Not may be, AM


And that's why I'm not standing up to the national and going "Nuh-uh, he's right!" He worded it wrong, didn't use science, and just relied on paraphrasing what others told him.

Edited by Linus - 24 August 2012 at 1:29am