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Toyota 86 / Scion FR-S

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    Posted: 22 March 2012 at 2:05am
Any of you guys seen one of these?

I generally ignore new car announcements, but I gotta admit this is a sekze new car-



Not bad for a Scion.

The 'Yota version is pretty similar. Looks like a 350Z and a Honda S2000 had a love child. Its not as fast as a Z, but I think it runs in the low 20K range and was designed by Subaru, so I could totally see it as a near little work car.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoboCop Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 6:45am
Manual is at $24,930 and auto is at ~$25,300.
200hp on premium gas (probably my least favorite part about this car)
~22 mpg city, ~30 mpg highway

I have been waiting on this car. It has the subaru flat 4 boxer engine, but I believe the styling and body comes from toyota. The BRZ is the subaru equivalent.
Here is the actual production version



BRZ concept


http://www.scion.com/cars/FR-S/

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stratoaxe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 7:38am
Wow, 3 manufacturers pushing the same car...I wonder if Lexus will do something with it?

200HP isnt great nowadays, but I'm sure other versions will see the light of day eventually. Besides, I'd just like to have it as a daily driver. It's supposed to be amazing out on the highway.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tallen702 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 9:21am
Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:

Wow, 3 manufacturers pushing the same car...I wonder if Lexus will do something with it?

200HP isnt great nowadays, but I'm sure other versions will see the light of day eventually. Besides, I'd just like to have it as a daily driver. It's supposed to be amazing out on the highway.


200BHP in a super light car is all you need. You have to remember, these things are TINY! Barely bigger than an MX5 Miata.

Also, I totally sat in the BRZ at the Washington Auto Show last month:
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoboCop Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 9:23am
It's going to be a driver's car. Handle really well with its well balanced front and rear with a really low center of gravity. So in turns, people will love it. It's not a fast car, but it is a boxer engine. They are begging to be turbo'd. The Greddy Scion FR-S will be hitting the Formula Drift series in the next couple of weeks with Ken Gushi. It is pushing over 800 in a different boxer 4 cylinder.

Oh and scion is only a US and Canada manufacturer so in the rest of the world, the FT 86 is under Toyota. I was hoping for the badge to say Toyota though.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stratoaxe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 10:56am
Originally posted by Tallen702 Tallen702 wrote:

200BHP in a super light car is all you need. You have to remember, these things are TINY! Barely bigger than an MX5 Miata.


Very true. That's what alot of people don't realize when they're looking at HP ratings.

Take my Mustang GT. It has the 315 horse 4.6, which looks incredibly weak compared to the Dodge and Chevy offerings. But when you figure in HP to weight ratio and suspension I can destroy a Challenger through a quarter and at least keep up with an SS through the first few gears. Of course top end I'll have trouble, and the SS generally just outclassed my year, but still a good driver can pull low 13's out of a 2010 and mid-high 12's out of the 2011.

Even crazier is that Americanmuscle.com is selling the coyote engine for 7K. That's an amazing deal for 413 HP out of the box.

But my Ford love aside, as Robo said, this thing is begging for turbos. 200 HP is fine for a daily driver, but just think about how much fun that car would be at around 280-300, and you wouldn't need a super amazing turbo / sc to get that. I think that car weighs right around 2700 pounds...that would be so much fun.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stratoaxe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 10:59am
Double post...edit button sucks...

22-30 is kind of a disappointing gas mileage rating considering the weight.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoboCop Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 2:13pm
A mix of premium gas and low mpg is really killing it. It's all due to the transmission. I wonder what it will be geared like. It probably has short gears to help with the low torque. I know some shops aren't looking forward to manufacturing a turbo for this car. High compression ratios make it harder for better turbo gains, but it is still possible. But that high compression is the only reason it gets 200 hp. I wish it was low compression with a bigger engine (2.5 liter) so that it would have a good amount of torque and be able to hold higher boost for more power. I do want this car, but if I can start making money soon, I'd grab one, swap the engine out for something like the EJ25 and boost it. But I'll leave that to dreaming for now. I really want to test drive one though.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SSOK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 2:51pm
As most of you know, I am an American-car loving, Import hating car enthusiast. 

I think this car is going to sell quite well, considering its sporty looks and relatively cheap price. You get a lot of car for a fair price, even though I am obligated to say you can buy a Mustang for cheaper that will leave it in the dust LOL. The 20 somethings crowd is going to love these. 

What I am probably going hate about them is I believe that this will be the next Honda Civic of the "ricer" culture, but it is definitely going to have more oomph than a 4dr economy car turned "sports car". I see a dozen or so grocery getters with fartcans every day, and I already see a bunch of new TC's thrown into the mix. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tallen702 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 4:19pm
Originally posted by SSOK SSOK wrote:

As most of you know, I am an American-car loving, Import hating car enthusiast. 

I think this car is going to sell quite well, considering its sporty looks and relatively cheap price. You get a lot of car for a fair price, even though I am obligated to say you can buy a Mustang for cheaper that will leave it in the dust LOL. The 20 somethings crowd is going to love these. 

What I am probably going hate about them is I believe that this will be the next Honda Civic of the "ricer" culture, but it is definitely going to have more oomph than a 4dr economy car turned "sports car". I see a dozen or so grocery getters with fartcans every day, and I already see a bunch of new TC's thrown into the mix. 


I doubt you'll see them riced as much as the old CRX/Prelude crowd did. As stated earlier, they're barely bigger than a MX5.



Comparing it to a Mustang is comparing apples to oranges. If you want to compare it to something, compare it to the Focus/Fiesta RS classes. We're talking tuned 4-banger in a compact space. It's made for driving, not going fast in a straight line. I'd put one of these things against a 'stang or other muscle car on any road track any day. The allure of the quarter mile has been dying in this country for some time now. The only thing keeping mustangs and camaros selling these days is the nostalgic boomer generation, girls, and to some extent, younger guys who have fallen into the mindset of the the boomer generation. Cadillac realized this and now uses the Nurbergring as their benchmark. Hyundai knows it, hence the Genesis. Subaru and Toyota know it, hence the BRZ, Mazda has known it for sometime, hence the speed3. The US has yet to put up a competitor worth looking at.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rofl_Mao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 5:05pm
That Scion is a sexy car if I say so myself.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote God Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 6:09pm
I think my next car will be purchased with luxury in mind. I am tired of hearing a ton of road noise and  feeling every bump in the road.

My tC has been paid off for a while. It is nice banking away the car payment every month.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tallen702 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 6:39pm
Originally posted by God God wrote:

I think my next car will be purchased with luxury in mind. I am tired of hearing a ton of road noise and  feeling every bump in the road.

My tC has been paid off for a while. It is nice banking away the car payment every month.


Excuse me, I'd just like to ask a question. What does God need with a car?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stratoaxe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 8:06pm
Originally posted by Tallen Tallen wrote:

  The allure of the quarter mile has been dying in this country for some time now. The only thing keeping mustangs and camaros selling these days is the nostalgic boomer generation, girls, and to some extent, younger guys who have fallen into the mindset of the the boomer generation.
 
I'd have to heartily disagree with this statement.
 
Now bear in mind my lusts in life are a Porsche, a 370Z, or a CTS V. So I'm really not the Mustang snob I come off as..it just so happens to be the most fun I can afford in my price bracket.
 
That said, I'd say the 2010+ Muskrats would surprise you on a road test. The track pack equipped models (such as mine) really blew away most magazines as far as cornering goes. They're not going to compete with Z cars or such, but for what they are they're fantastic handlers. Far better so than the Challenger and Camaro in road tests.
 
As far as the quarter mile thing, it's important to differentiate muscle cars from pony cars. Really and honestly I can't think of a single modern muscle car aside from the SRT-8 Challenger. Muscle cars were big, heavy boats with high power big blocks that shot them through quarter mile strips...think the Road Runner, GTO, GTX, 4-4-2, etc. This started and ended with the 60's muscle car era...but the Mustang, Camaro, Firebird, Cougar, and Challenger came along and invented the pony car and trans am racing. Those cars were traditionally built for a combination of light weight handling and decent horsepower.
 
Truth be told there weren't many heavy quarter mile hitting pony cars. Mustangs in the 60's were pretty absymal, and most of the cars that broke into the 12 second class were Road Runners and special order engines. The muscle car era was all about cubic inches.
 
Every car nowadays has a certain expectation of handling to it (except the Challenger...but that car really does fall into the "baby boomer throwback class"), but they also excel in the quarter.
 
As far as popularity, I really don't see quarter mile racing as popular. I think the shift to cars that measure their life blood by 0-60 / quarter mile really comes down to practicality, at least where I come from. The days where you could open up on the highway and really scream around here are over...it's too congested and the legal penalties are crazy stiff (in Texas I believe competition of speed involves a revokation of your license). So practically people just want a car that they can jam it from a rolling stop and tinker around with on back roads. I don't have many friends who build performance cars that have actually ever tested them on a quarter mile track, they just like the rush of extreme acceleration.
 
Not to say that road racing wouldn't be amazing fun...I'd love to get involved. But the price of entry to get a road ready car and hook up with a local club is pretty hefty unless you've just got the cash to do so. My sister's Corvette club has a track they use to tinker with their toys, plus a couple of airstrips, but it's crazy expensive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ammolord Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 9:46pm
Funny this came up, im saving for the FT-86 (GT-86 from what iv heard) right now. When they are available for order im getting a white one with whatever manual gear box they come out with. Iv been watching this since they unveiled it, and hearing that they are basing it on the AE-86 weight distribution and the low power, tight handling was appealing to me. I cant wait to get behind the wheel and see what they can do.

Edited by ammolord - 22 March 2012 at 9:47pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tallen702 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 10:22pm
Originally posted by __sneaky__ __sneaky__ wrote:

I thought you drove a cloud?


Someone missed my witty quote reference....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoboCop Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 10:31pm
Originally posted by ammolord ammolord wrote:

Funny this came up, im saving for the FT-86 (GT-86 from what iv heard) right now..

Unless you import one, you are stuck with a Scion FR-S. The states will never get a toyota badged ft-86.

Oh and they had a first 86 program for whoever won the raffle. You are not obligated to buy the car, but being selected in the raffle, the 86 people got this email,
"Congratulations! As one of the First 86 you’ve been invited to attend a special 4 day and 3 night trip to Southern California from April 5, 2012 – April 8, 2012. All expenses will be paid including accommodations and travel.

Join us for an exclusive tour of Toyota Motor Sports National Headquarters, a special dinner hosted by Scion featuring guest speaker Jack Hollis, Vice President of Scion, and a front row seat to Formula Drift Round 1: Streets of Long Beach and the debut of the GReddy Racing Scion FR-S drift car. More information is attached."

I should have entered the raffle just for that. I know I can't buy the car anytime soon so I didn't enter it, but it seems like it wasn't that rare to win the raffle. A couple of people on one of my forums claim to have won.


Edited by RoboCop - 22 March 2012 at 10:36pm

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote __sneaky__ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 March 2012 at 10:34pm
Originally posted by tallen702 tallen702 wrote:

Originally posted by __sneaky__ __sneaky__ wrote:

I thought you drove a cloud?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ammolord Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 March 2012 at 8:35pm
Originally posted by RoboCop RoboCop wrote:

Originally posted by ammolord ammolord wrote:

Funny this came up, im saving for the FT-86 (GT-86 from what iv heard) right now..

Unless you import one, you are stuck with a Scion FR-S. The states will never get a toyota badged ft-86.

This is true, but I can always re-badge it. No matter what the name is, i'm still stoked about this car (more than I think I've ever been about a car).
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