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Kony 2012

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impulse418 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote impulse418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 March 2012 at 5:52pm
We should put troops in afghanistan, to take care of the child slavery. Which includes them getting raped every thursday.

Wait, I just found out we already have troops there, and we don't care about that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lightningbolt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 March 2012 at 6:04pm
Hey impulse is that an alien sitting in a chair in your goggle reflection?
Sent from a phone booth
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agentwhale007 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 March 2012 at 7:08pm
Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:

Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:

My personal opinion of the actual Ugandan situation aside, it's a little disheartening that a generally good piece of information went around social networking platforms, and in almost no time flat was met with a flooding level of cynicism. As much as millennials get a good reputation for collective activism and optimism, there are a lot of people who are either pessimistic or are just too cool for school. 


That was me.

Though not criticizing the message, just the organization and its shadiness.


I had a long response written up to the general silliness of people thinking Invisible Children is somehow shady, but the spam filter ate it. 

All of their information is public record, as is their audit scores and independent rankings. They've done well on all of those things. 


"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 March 2012 at 7:30pm
Originally posted by usafpilot07 usafpilot07 wrote:

 I just took the time out of my day to do some further research into Invisible Children after seeing the video(so their movement worked there), and didn't like what I saw.
 

It's cute that your vast Internet research is essentially just the same rehashed, conflated arguments made by other too-cool-for-school Internet cynics. Maybe that's just coincidence. 

Quote The man uses his films to fund his own jaunts around the world and his films, while claiming its all an effort to empower the youth and save lives.

Did your vast Internet research point out that there are three main operators/filmmakers for Invisible Children, not one? 

I'm sure your vast Internet research found that their 990 forms, as a non-profit based in the U.S., are not only public record, but are also posted on their own site. I'm sure your research also found their Charity Navigator score of 4/5, with their full 5-star rating on expense usage. 

I'm also confused as to the statement that they're somehow misappropriating funds, or somehow swindling those who donate. Yes, they spend a whole lot on travel, that is a legitimate criticism. But they've never billed themselves as an aid-based non-profit. They're an awareness-based non-profit. They don't hand out rice and water. There is the Red Cross for that. And that's cool, it's just not what Invisible Children has ever really set out to be. 

Since at least 2006, they've used their money made from events on college and high school campuses like the Global Night Commute to fund forward more films and events to raise awareness. Because that's what they are. An awareness-raising non-profit. Their goal has pretty much always been to get people to pay attention to the goings-on of central Africa and the atrocities committed against children.

If you look at their expense reports, they spend about 37% on aid in Africa, including scholarships, a radio alert program, medical supplies, teachers, etc. They spend about 25% on awareness programs. That is their various events, promotions, things like the Global Night Commute. They spend about 16% on promotional materials like shirts, bracelets, DVDs and distribution, as well as film production. 

All in all, they operationalize about 80.5% of their revenue through one of those three means. Yes, only about 37% is spent on direct aid, but again, that has never been their primary goal. 

Not to mention, the main three organizers take in a $90k per-year salary. I'm sure your vast Internet research showed you that for a non-profit the size of Invisible Children, as in one taking in $13 million+ each year in total primary revenue, $90k is really rather low. Most non-profits of their size have CEOs making six digits. 

So to accuse them of somehow lining their pockets is rather silly. 

If you want to donate to a rice-and-water charity like Red Cross, that's awesome. But to judge Invisible Children based on the percentage Red Cross spends on aid is like comparing the tastes of a red delicious to a tangerine. 

Quote But what he does is use his movement to generate income for his organization, while making his "message" that we need to pressure Congress to do something. It's a little deceptive in my opinion.


They've been open about their lobbying efforts. They post links to the bills they've supported in congress and their lobbying targets. 

If they're trying to be deceptive, they're doing an awful job of it. 

Quote The Ugandan government isn't exactly a girl scout troop of humane actions. You're basically picking the lesser of two evils, where the lesser evil is a corrupt, mass-murdering dictator who has done plenty of damage on his own to his people.

This is a legitimate concern and criticism -- one they actively try to address, but it doesn't always work out. Here is how they responded: 

Originally posted by Invisible Children Invisible Children wrote:

 
Re: Ugandan government human rights record - We do not defend any of the human rights abuses perpetrated by the Ugandan government or the Ugandan army (UPDF). None of the money donated through Invisible Children ever goes to the government of Uganda or any other government.  Yet the only feasible and proper way to stop Kony and protect the civilians he targets is to coordinate efforts with regional governments.

This is where people should be focusing their cynicism. 

But tossing around the 30% aid statistic like it's something to be worried about makes you look rather silly. At least for someone claiming to have done research on the topic. 


Edited by agentwhale007 - 10 March 2012 at 7:35pm
"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 March 2012 at 7:47pm
Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:

I think we just view it differently. Especially in your line of work I understand that spreading knowledge is important.

Truefax, yo. 

No doubt my own agency clouds my rationalization for a lot of it. I could probably even be accused of optimism as much as you could pessimism. 

"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 March 2012 at 9:01pm
usafpilot07, I was in a bad mood due to outside circumstances when I wrote my response to you, so I apologize for the undoubtedly angered tone it carries.  
"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GroupB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 March 2012 at 9:18pm
I would be willing to bet that I have the fewest degrees of separation between myself and Kony at 2
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Snipa69 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 March 2012 at 11:59pm
Originally posted by usafpilot07 usafpilot07 wrote:

Originally posted by agentwhale007 agentwhale007 wrote:

Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:

 and so when some duck face starts going off on OMG WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING it generally invokes a large amount of facepalm from the majority who both knew about and were bothered by world events most of their life.

It just seems overly pessimistic to look down on someone, or be overly cynical, about someone learning about an issue they didn't know about before. 

When I see people who otherwise never knew or cared about any sort of world event start to care because of something like the Invisible Children promotions (I honestly saw more of this with their GNC and Displace Me events, but that was also when I was a freshman in undergraduate, when a lot of people are learning about foreign events for the first time) it makes me happy, and I hope it sparks their interest in these things. It doesn't matter if it was just because it was a hot trend item on Facebook, they've seen it, and now they have the potential to do something to help, even if it's something small. 

It seems like fostering that attitude is way more beneficial (And less gloomy, emotionally) than scoffing and going "Pffft, you didn't know about that before now? Lame." 


It has nothing to do with me being cynical or too cool for school. I just took the time out of my day to do some further research into Invisible Children after seeing the video(so their movement worked there), and didn't like what I saw.  The man uses his films to fund his own jaunts around the world and his films, while claiming its all an effort to empower the youth and save lives.

I have zero problem with people wanting to become more informed in the plights in other portions of the world, and if they decide to donate to a cause that directly benefits those places? Great. If the videos actually explained what people could do to help in those situations? Even better.

But what he does is use his movement to generate income for his organization, while making his "message" that we need to pressure Congress to do something. It's a little deceptive in my opinion.


Also, this.

Originally posted by Snipa69 Snipa69 wrote:



Shocking to some, but that was/is the mentality of a lot of troops in the area. The gov't if you want to call it that is so unstable and just as corrupt as any other that killing one warlord dictator just puts another one who will end up being worse in power. Kony has been in hiding since 06, and the people of Uganda have all felt a sense of peace since then. In fact, some say it has been the most peace the region has seen in decades. Yes, he was a bad guy and still is. But we are 6 years too late for bandwagon jump-ons who want to make a difference. 


The Ugandan government isn't exactly a girl scout troop of humane actions. You're basically picking the lesser of two evils, where the lesser evil is a corrupt, mass-murdering dictator who has done plenty of damage on his own to his people.

Yeah, and I've seen how the gov't does it's work out there. Let them figure it out. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote impulse418 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 March 2012 at 5:14am

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ceesman762 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 March 2012 at 8:59am
Wow! African children being kidnapped, raped and/or forced to become soldiers?  I seen this before.  Liberia in 1990.
Innocence proves nothing
FUAC!!!!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveEllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 March 2012 at 10:58am
Originally posted by Ceesman762 Ceesman762 wrote:

Wow! African children being kidnapped, raped and/or forced to become soldiers?  I seen this before.  Liberia in 1990.

Post + Avatar=Made me LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote usafpilot07 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 March 2012 at 12:14pm
Whale, I was writing up a pretty decent response to you(and I don't take it personally, everyone has bad days. That combined with us being on opposite sides of the issue can equal a hostile-seeming response), but at this point I feel like the discussion in this thread is going to get drowned out by Impulse's crazy.

I will leave it at this. They may have a 4 star rating for financial actions through Charity Navigator, but their accountability rating is 2/4. IC claims this is only because they only have 3 board members(And yes, I did research the structure of their organization), but elsewhere it is reportedly because they will not let outside sources audit their financial records. That alone raises flags for me.

Plain and simple, I don't like their message, or the manner they go about operating their foundation. I would LOVE to be wrong about the majority of it, and I don't want to sound like a huge pessimist, I just think there are better routes to affecting change in Africa, and he isn't going about it in that way.


I'd also throw out there that the reason a lot of the pessimists you see on FB and such repeating the same bullet points against IC is a result of the same reason proponents use a few facts to support it. The most obvious and impactful facts in most stories like this are going to be the easiest ones to spread.


Edited by usafpilot07 - 11 March 2012 at 12:20pm
Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 March 2012 at 1:00pm
Originally posted by usafpilot07 usafpilot07 wrote:

I don't take it personally, everyone has bad days.

I appreciate your graciousness. 

Quote but at this point I feel like the discussion in this thread is going to get drowned out by Impulse's crazy.

I'm sure this has something to do with the Federal Reserve Bank somehow. 

Quote They may have a 4 star rating for financial actions through Charity Navigator, but their accountability rating is 2/4. IC claims this is only because they only have 3 board members(And yes, I did research the structure of their organization), but elsewhere it is reportedly because they will not let outside sources audit their financial records. That alone raises flags for me.
 

This is a valuable criticism. And from what I've heard (I have friends in Invisible Children's planning division) they are actively trying to find ways to increase that score by expanding their board of directors and to bring in more independent auditors. Granted, that info is from someone being paid by them, so salt, grains, etc. 

As for the rest of it, it's a valid disagrement.
"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ceesman762 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 March 2012 at 5:48pm
Originally posted by DaveEllis DaveEllis wrote:

Originally posted by Ceesman762 Ceesman762 wrote:

Wow! African children being kidnapped, raped and/or forced to become soldiers?  I seen this before.  Liberia in 1990.

Post + Avatar=Made me LOL

This one is for you, Dave!

Innocence proves nothing
FUAC!!!!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rednekk98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2012 at 7:21pm
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