Occupy ____________

SSOK wrote: Rofl_Mao wrote: Benjichang wrote: We need to stop pushing this myth that everyone needs to go to college. Everyone shouldn't go to college. I found out it wasn't for me the hard way, now I'm faced with the consequences. Expecting kids out of high school to come up with what they want to do for the rest of their lives when they have no life experience and hardly know who they are is ridiculous. Here, here! QFT As for Unions, I feel that they are a great tool to ensure workers are not stepped on and abused by companies. I feel the UAW is screwing themselves over, though.

Edited by ParielIsBack - 26 October 2011 at 7:49pm

Oh, and on the topic of the OWS (Since that is what this thread is actually about), there is a fund running around the Internet to help donate money to the Marine veteran who was hit in the head with a tear gas canister in Oakland at close range. 

agentwhale007 wrote: Rofl_Mao wrote: Benjichang wrote: We need to stop pushing this myth that everyone needs to go to college. Everyone shouldn't go to college. I found out it wasn't for me the hard way, now I'm faced with the consequences. Expecting kids out of high school to come up with what they want to do for the rest of their lives when they have no life experience and hardly know who they are is ridiculous. Here, here! I concur with the statement as well, but I wonder how much of the solution could be front-end versus back-end.  Should we more encourage people, after high school, to determine what they want out of life before theyt think about going to a big university, like vocational programs? Or should we encourage people in high school to determine what they want at an earlier stage?  As in, if you show an interest and aptitude in "topic A," by 10th grade, you start studying into that more while studying other subjects less. It could be anything from art to engineering to math to writing.  Either way, both solutions will require public funds (A hefty amount) and a cultural paradigm shift (Which we cannot pay for). But needed, I think. As I agree with the both of you.  It's just a matter of how to fix it.

The problem with this Whale, is (as OPBN touched on) the issue that there is a large amount of HS students that honestly have no clue what they want to do, including myself last year. I am now in CC studying I.T., but after studying the networking portion of the curriculum I am having doubts about making a career of this. I am basically back to square one and I am lucky CC didn't cost me too much. I believe what OPBN said about the guidance counsellors, but I think it should go more than that and actually have one class each year of high school (or at least grade 11-12) devoted to career selection. In the class there should be opportunities for the students to find jobs they think they will be interested in, including university educated ones, and have the students go in depth with those job selections to see whether or not they want to study for it in secondary education. The class should also teach financing to be sure the students know what they are getting into with student loans/lines of credit. I think it would be an eye-opener to the youth to see that some careers are completely different from what they are portrayed as on TV.


Edit: I see thats basically exactly what you were suggesting, now that I see your post. But the difference I think is that it shouldn't be a locked-in thing. Students should be able to change their job focus throughout the class as they research the different careers. What I'm saying is, if they think they are interested in mechanics or philosophy at first, they shouldn't have to focus just on that one subject throughout the years. They should be open to different careers if you get what I'm saying.


Edited by Rofl_Mao - 27 October 2011 at 10:05am

OPBN hit several points I've been thinking about.

oldpbnoob wrote: Oddly enough, my daughter who is 8th grade has brought home a few papers that have dealt with occupation selection. When I first read this I took it as the teachers handing out papers detailing how to select targets for protest occupation. LOL (FE's been a bad influence.) In one, they had to think of 3 occupations that they might have an interest in that started with each letter of the alphabet. They also took some sort of aptitude test which pissed her off because she didn't get anything even close that sounded interesting to her. I'm with her on that.  The VA made me take similar tests before I went back to school.  I scored well and was told I could pick any vocation I wanted.  Once I picked, they asked where I was planning on living.  (Most veterans apparently return to their home states.)  When I stated I was staying in Montana, they suddenly limited my choices because of the poor economy up here.  (I could be an accountant*, a dental technician**, or an x-ray tech.***)  Not being happy with these choices, I ended up with selecting a major and minors that allowed a lot of flexibility in employment.   I have to second the financial class aspect. I think there should be a "Real World" class where kids have to balance make a budget, balance a checkbook, write a resume, fill out college applications, learn childcare, etc. Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes, and Yes. . . . oh, and Yes.  I used to deal with so many young troops whose parents had done pretty much everything for them and were completely ill-prepared for the real world.  My favorite was a young lady who was on the verge of losing rank/pay for repeated violations of room cleanliness standards.  (These are health/safety issues as well as being a military standards issue.)  When talking to her, something her supervisor had apparently not done, it came out that she had never had to clean a room because her mom had done it for her up to the age of 20 when she joined the AF. Yeah, I know a lot of this should be taught at home, but honestly, I have my doubts . . . I don't have any doubts, I know.  I spent a lot of time teaching resume writing and assigning junior supervisors to help with checkbooks and budgets. . . . about most of the parents around here have a clue about most of these things themselves. Heck, I'm not sure if I could even write a resume anymore.   On a more related note, I saw another couple of segments on the news regarding student loans and the occutards. This seems to be more and more the focus of the "movement". If it is, I have no sympathy for them.  You take out loans, you pay them . . . period. They were saying that the average debt by graduating college students was like $25k or so. If true, I really don't see the big deal. Seems like all the college students need to do is get a job and live with their parents for a couple of years until they pay their loans off. As a former parent; I don't think so.  (Will I help them out, sure . . . but they don't need to be in the house.) I wonder if part of the issue today is the mindset that once you graduate from college, you immediately have to move away and jump feet first into independence. Maybe, but I think part of it is that they have unrealistic expectations as well.  My wife has a lot of experience as an accountant and the biggest issue she sees with new graduates is they expect to come into large businesses and immediately become CFOs or the equivalent.  Some get disillusioned and leave for lower paying jobs at smaller institutions where they get to do more decision makers and some get asked to leave because they, thinking they know better, make a habit of ignoring policies and superiors. While I applaud the idea, maybe it's time to become more extended family oriented. Take my brother in law for example. He graduated from college with his 4 year degree and a little debt. He went on to graduate school to get his PA degree and came out with $60-80k of debt.  Granted, he had a very marketable degree and immediately got a good paying job, but rather than trying to live on his own, he moved back in with his parents and paid off all of his bills. He actually went on to save and adiditonal amount of money and put a 50% downpayment on his house. Within two years, he paid it off. They can do the same thing by just being smart with their money.  News flash recent graduates . . . big screen TVs, new cars, and the latest/fanciest communications electronics are not needs; they are wants . . . wants that are best put on hold until one is financially secure.   Which brings up the a subject we have discussed before... degrees that pay off vs degrees that don't. I wonder how many of the pissed off occupiers are screaming and yelling about their college debt have Art History, Philosophy, or some other degree that rarely ends up in a job other than in academia? This.  I saw a lot of this while going to school.  (And that was at a college that was fairly conservative and real-world oriented.)

*One accountant in the family is enough.
**I am not sticking my fingers in peoples mouths.  (That's just asking to be among the first victims of a zombie outbreak.)
***X-ray tech seemed really interesting . . . so of course I was disqualified by my medical history regarding back injuries.

oldpbnoob wrote: Which brings up the a subject we have discussed before... degrees that pay off vs degrees that don't. I wonder how many of the pissed off occupiers are screaming and yelling about their college debt have Art History, Philosophy, or some other degree that rarely ends up in a job other than in academia?

Mack wrote:   If it is, I have no sympathy for them.  You take out loans, you pay them . . . period.

 

The occupiers had a rally in my hometown the other day.  10 people showed up. 

evillepaintball wrote: The occupiers had a rally in my hometown the other day.  10 people showed up.

I think this can be translated to pretty much any other city in the country. There may be thousands of protesters in NYC, but compare it to the overall population and its a very small number.

If I lived on Wall Street in my town, I'd be the guy running the hot dog stand and price-gouging for both food products and restroom usage.


Just for the irony.


Apparently my brain is messed up as well.