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Deer Hunting/Optics.

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kickinwing2010 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 01 October 2011 at 3:11pm
So this year will be my first year going out and shooting myself a deer. I will be using an SKS which is 7.62x39, eventually I plan on upgrading but I am poor so this is the best I could do for now. My question is, is this gun going to be good enough and what would be my best bet for some budget glass to put on top of it. I plan to go out and shoot it with iron sights to see what I can do but I also want a scope regardless.
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http://www.scopemounts.com/index.html?main.html

I have their insta mount for my M44, it is very solid and easily handles the recoil. 

 As for cheap glass, I have a Simmons on the Mosin  http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=785343

and a Bushnell on my Marlin 30-30 similar to the one below.  I have not had any trouble with either.


As for the SKS being "enough", check your state's hunting laws.  Indiana's lists certain calibers loads that are illegal for being too small.  Here, the bullet diameter must be greater than .357, so an SKS would be illegal.  


Edited by GroupB - 01 October 2011 at 4:57pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rednekk98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 October 2011 at 5:00pm
7.62x39mm is ballistically similar to a .30-30win, it should do the job to 150 yards or so, and iron sights should* be fine to that distance. Don't use a top-cover mount for scoping it, it will not hold zero. If you need to use to sight base you may end up needing a scout-type scope, which is something that won't necessarily be a good thing to mount on a different rifle when you upgrade. Bushnell, Nikkon, and lower-end Leopoulds are decent optics. You might be able to find a VX-II for around $200. If you're going to put glass on a rifle, get something good. Cheap scopes have a way of changing zero on you without warning and for no logical reason, even if mounted on a .22. I don't know where you're hunting, but unless you live in a place w/ a bumper crop of deer and have a doe tag, don't count on shooting, or even seeing anything your first year out there, but practice, and be patient. Shooting is a very small part of deer hunting.

With the SKS, get some ammo that will actually expand, you really shouldn't run the crappy eastern-european stuff. Get a box to check point of impact and for practice, devote 80% of your practice to off-hand and the rest to field-realistic positions (i'm in the hills so open-legged sitting, or using a tree to lean into are likely). An SKS can be pretty accurate w/ the right ammo and if it's a well put together rifle. What's the country of origin and condition? I've been able to achieve good** results at 300 yards with IMI ammo (Branded as Hansen ammo) and I think the Winchester white box stuff at least uses IMI brass. I believe Hornady loads ballistic tip rounds for the SKS and their ammo is top-notch.

*irons work if your eyes are good, scopes help you "thread the needle" in brush and give you a couple extra minutes of shooting light in the day. My first deer was taken at over 100 yards w/ irons on a rifled-barreled 20ga that i've been telling myself I'm going to scope for years.
** Could consistently(80% or better) hit a 12" gong at 200 yards from any position, could consistently hit a steel sillhouette at 300 standing, and make head shots from sitting or prone. The bayo makes an OK monopod as well. I had a father and son watching me shoot the thing as they were having trouble with a scoped mini-14 at 25 yards, ask me a lot about the rifle and showed up with a Yugo a week later that still had so much cosmoline in the bolt it would FTF, they were also afraid to let me take it apart and look at it to find out what was wrong.

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oldsoldier View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldsoldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 October 2011 at 5:39pm
7.62x39 is a poor hunting round. As mentioned you need to get soft points, eastern block ball will just punch a hole and you are chasing a deer a few miles waitin for it to bleed out.

Also 100m is your MAX range with 7X62X39, round slows too fast after that, no 'punch' when it gets there after 100m, out here in Nebraska in the still standing feed corn fields if you can not get within 50m you are doing something wrong. So a scope is not needed. 3 years in a row, big buck, less than 50m with a .54 1863 Sharps black powder, I don't chase deer. Also on SKS balistic line and sight line cross at 200m, aim accordingly, at 100m round will be about 1/2in lower than sight line.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rednekk98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 October 2011 at 6:15pm
7.62X39mm ballistics

1k ft/lbs energy is considered the minimum for deer (depending on size, shot placement, bullet construction etc.) so somewhere between 100 and 200 yards you lose that. That being said, you can ethically shoot a deer at whatever range you can consistently hit the vitals (8" circle) at providing the rifle/ammo is up to the task. The .357 and up thing sounds like it's a handgun restriction, rifle restrictions are usually .24" and up. I'd be strange if a 30-06 and even a .375 H&H were considered illegal for deer. Get yourself a few deer targets with the vitals outlined for target practice. Hornady's SST bullets are great performers. My shotgun load fires a 250gr Hornady SST in a Sabot at 1800fps. In a 6.4lb gun it hits hard on both ends. I wouldn't scope the SKS if I were you, it's a hassle.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kickinwing2010 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 October 2011 at 7:36pm
Alright thanks everyone, I am planning on using hornady when it comes time to head out to the field. But in the mean time I have 80 rounds of fmj surplus rounds I plan to put down range for target practice. Will probably go ahead and run open sites this time around to see how it treats me. One of my room mates who are the people I hunt with uses a 22-250 for his dear rifle so i don't know how that comares to the 7.62x39 of the sks. The other uses a .300 mag with IMO is a bit overkill. Also I will be hunting in Nebraska where the deer come out of the woods by the dozen.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldsoldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 October 2011 at 7:52pm
I get to sit on my back porch, and deer walk right out of the standing corn and head for a litle patch of short pines in corner of property. Less than 150m. Walked out there and there are a few 'lays' where deer are overnighting.

So my choices are my 1863 .54 Sharps, My M91/30 7.62X54R, My SMLE .303Brit, 1903 30.06, 1873 Springfield Cavalry Trapdoor Carbine .45/70, or get close an my .58 1863 Springfield.

Also Turkey walk the fields in gaggles of 25plus.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mbro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 October 2011 at 8:57pm
Originally posted by GroupB GroupB wrote:

As for the SKS being "enough", check your state's hunting laws.  Indiana's lists certain calibers loads that are illegal for being too small.  Here, the bullet diameter must be greater than .357, so an SKS would be illegal.  
In wisconsin the smallest legal deer round is .22 centerfire.

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GroupB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 October 2011 at 11:23pm
Originally posted by rednekk98 rednekk98 wrote:

7.62X39mm ballistics

 The .357 and up thing sounds like it's a handgun restriction, rifle restrictions are usually .24" and up
"
Rifles with cartridges that fire a bullet of .357-inch diameter or larger; have a 
minimum case length of 1.16 inches; and 
have a maximum case length of 1.625 inches 
are legal to use only during the deer firearm 
season. Some cartridges legal for deer 
hunting include the .357 Magnum, .38-.40 
Winchester, .41 Magnum, .41 Special, .44 
Magnum, .44 Special, .44-.40 Winchester, 
.45 Colt, .454 Casull, .458 SOCOM, .475 
Linebaugh, .480 Ruger, .50 Action Express, 
and .500 S&W. "
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote merc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 October 2011 at 3:08pm
sounds like pistol calibers still. maybe even for rifles in pistol caliber.

that would make .243, .270, 7mm mag, .30-06, .308, 300 win mag, even to small for deer? guess its 357 H&H, 45-70 and 50bmg for me

edit: as for optics. i dont know how much they cost but nikon makes some sexy glass.

Edited by merc - 02 October 2011 at 3:47pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rednekk98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 October 2011 at 8:49pm
That's what i'll be running this year, the stock set is new and I'm considering scoping it, still in the process of determining what type of mount and scope i'll use, if any. .22 centerfires seem underpowered to me. Maybe a small deer with something like a 77gr bullet and precise shot placement would do it, but I'd say .243 would be the minimum I'd use for a rifle. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote huntingopticsxxx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 April 2012 at 6:35am
I'm a deer hunting hunter and uses hunting scopes too.
Binoculars are great Hunting Optics tools.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ceesman762 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 April 2012 at 10:35am
On the SKS? A nice 4x or 3x9 should be good. Bushnell is decent and relatively in-expensive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eville Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 April 2012 at 1:53pm
Originally posted by Ceesman762 Ceesman762 wrote:

On the SKS? A nice 4x or 3x9 should be good. Bushnell is decent and relatively in-expensive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kayback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 April 2012 at 3:47am
Optics don't help you shoot better, they help you SEE better.

That restriction of .357 + still sounds like they are talking about pistol caliber carbines. Other wise the .338 Lap Mag is also illegal and I doubt you'll find anyone who says a .338 Lap Mag is insufficient to knock down a lil old deer. Even at 800 yards :)

With the minimum and maximum case length it sounds like they are restricting you to only pistol ammo. 1.625" max length?Huh?

That being said, 7.62x39mm is a decent enough cartridge, if you use good ammo and have good shot placement. Like others have said it is a very close range round, and it must be a soft point of some sort.

It isn't a .308 or a .30-06, but it isn't anything to be sneezed at either. Take your time, make your shots count and it should be GTG.

KBK



Edited by Kayback - 15 April 2012 at 4:03am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eville Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 April 2012 at 6:17am
Yeah, they restrict you to shotguns and rifles chambered in handgun rounds.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rednekk98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 April 2012 at 5:48pm
That makes sense. I'd rather have a pistol-caliber lever-gun than a shotgun in a lot of cases, especially considering ammo prices. Anyways, thinking of this scope for my shotgun.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kayback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 April 2012 at 4:09am
Ah, that clears it up then. I'd personally get a .45Colt. You can load those up to very decent velocities or have decent bullet weights, and they are common.

Some of the more exotic calibers like .500 S&W or .458 Socom are still a little rare for my liking.

The added bonus is you can easily reload .45Colt.

That being said it is very interesting that the .458 Socom is on the list. They make M4 pattern weapons chambered in that. That's probably the route I'd go for if I wasn't getting a nice lever action in .45Colt.

KBK
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote merc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 April 2012 at 8:53am
holy old post batman... did you get one?

being that its been a while since i posted i found something relevant...

vortex optics... clear, inexpensive, life time warranty... they have my business for a while...
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