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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2010 at 1:28pm
Originally posted by oldpbnoob oldpbnoob wrote:

I had to modify my JCS as well. I had milled and redrilled the holes where it mounted to the endcap to make it tilt down more so that when it was against my shoulder the sights were almost dead on. My problem was with the "hinge" . The pin that was supposed to keep it from closing didn't hold worth a crap and I could easily make it collapse without pushing the button.

Mine got like that after a while.  I took it apart and cleaned out the entire area and oiled all the parts and it worked flawlessly again.  (In my case I had actually got some shell and other debris in there.)

It was nice that it collapsed and adjusted for length though.
 
The gills are the best part.. I keep thinking about putting an LED in the breach so that it glows. And you would probably cry a little more as I cut up the other gilled M98 I had a few months ago for an E-bolted project that I can just never seem to find the time to finish.

Cutting up old Tippmanns makes Mack sad.

That, and I mounted the front grip too far forward, so now I have to redo the work that I already did. Which I hate doing. Angry In hindsight since I never really use this one, I should have just pillaged it for the body and kept the other one intact. Oh well..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tarrguy57 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2010 at 4:42pm
alright wow lots of stuff and too much to quote and reply to. mack i did end up buying a more realistic and heavier duty sight/carrying handle on ebay for $19 and bought the BT-16 barrel for $35 from amazon. i know i'm taking a gamble on both but i trust the internet alot more than i trust the creeps down at my local shop. i'm gonna do some digging and see if i can see what the local guys who play at the really big milsim games know about mag fed markers. um cyclone with tac cap? and i remember mack saying something about when people make/use ammo boxes they have a feed tube running back to the top of the marker, i have actually seen both on forums and in real life. if you're on pbnation i know there is at least 1 thread there about a guy giving a limited tutorial about how he made his. i can't remember if he did bottom feed or not though. as for the length of the stock, where would i get a shotgun pad? the issue with running a smaller hopper is that there is a milsim scenario up here that only allows mag fed guns so if you use a hoppered gun you wouldn't be allowed in but they allow free rentals when you pay to get it if you don't have a mag fed gun which is nice.  i know i'm forgetting something else but just don't have time to think about it right now. 
sweet gun oldpbnoob. an LED would be pretty awesome. but what color since the gun is from the looks of it striped metal and black paint/plastic?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2010 at 4:49pm
Most sporting goods stores carry the recoil pads for the shotguns.  The issues is finding one that fits/looks good.

A mag-fed only event sounds interesting.  The only problem is the only mag-fed markers I have are a T9 and a TPX.  (Maybe I could stick an ASA, stock and Evil Pipe tip on my USP and claim it was a simulated tube-feed Winchester.)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tarrguy57 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2010 at 4:59pm
Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:

Most sporting goods stores carry the recoil pads for the shotguns.  The issues is finding one that fits/looks good.

A mag-fed only event sounds interesting.  The only problem is the only mag-fed markers I have are a T9 and a TPX.  (Maybe I could stick an ASA, stock and Evil Pipe tip on my USP and claim it was a simulated tube-feed Winchester.)
um what? lol also what is a cyclone with tac cap? you mean a cyclone hopper (like an A5) with a tac cap (i figure a fast reload lid?)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2010 at 5:43pm
Regarding the Winchester comment:  Think of the old western movies and the lever action rifles.  (Joke, although I do have the remains of an old pump gun set aside for an eventual tube-feed, lever-action project based on those rifles.)

The tac caps, which were made by several companies in several different forms, replaced the stock Cyclone hopper and allowed the user to play with a 30 to 50 round hopper instead of 200 rounds.  They used to be very popular among mil-simmers who wanted to do limited ammo-capacity games without spending the money on a mag-fed marker.

Example




Edited by Mack - 03 September 2010 at 5:46pm
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)
Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:

Regarding the Winchester comment:  Think of the old western movies and the lever action rifles.  (Joke, although I do have the remains of an old pump gun set aside for an eventual tube-feed, lever-action project based on those rifles.)

The tac caps, which were made by several companies in several different forms, replaced the stock Cyclone hopper and allowed the user to play with a 30 to 50 round hopper instead of 200 rounds.  They used to be very popular among mil-simmers who wanted to do limited ammo-capacity games without spending the money on a mag-fed marker.

Example



as to a bolt-action paintball gun= epic
that would be awesome, there is a M1 Garand i believe made by RAP4 that is an authentic modified M1 (which would explain the $1500 price tagShocked) but i believe it was still hopper fed. let me know if you ever get around to that project. would be interesting to see. and yes now i know what you're talking about. that would be a pretty good option. but i figure that would get in the way of my folding stock Confused
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also i would love a TPX but i got 2 semi-upped delta .68s for less than 1 TPX. XD plus then that would mean buying extra mags at a pretty steep price and that i use a bottomline on my pistols cuz buying 12g cartridges gets a little spendy and finagalling the dumb thing to seat correctly so it doesn't dump and ruin the o-ring. so having a bottomline magazine for a TPX wouldn't work cuz it would add more time: empty clip, disconnect remote, dump mag, place in vest pouch, grab new mag, insert mag, reconnect remote, fire. too long in my book. but i'd still love to have one or maybe a real replica. know any replica pistols that take real paintballs? not wimpy .43 cal
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2010 at 6:58pm
This isn't a bolt action, but it is cool.

Link

I've seen similar setups modified to truly be bolt-action operation but I don't remember where/can't find them right now.

I picked up a Delta .68 quite a while back for a very good price.  (Free--courtesy of a friend who owns a paintball store and was sick of sending it back in and getting it back still broken.)  The CO2 loading system is very poorly designed but there is a solution.  I wish I could claim the solution was my idea but it isn't; I found out from another forumer in a discussion on here.  A much better designed piercing/sealing system from another pistol is a drop in replacement for the system on the Deltas. 

I bought one, installed it and have had no further problems.  (With the exception that the quick release lever for the CO2 catches on the bottom of the holster and releases itself.)  If I can remember which pistol the part is from I will post it.  (Actually, I will just try a search for the thread.)

A simpler fix was suggested elsewhere by the forumer known as Flurry who says that smearing Chapstick on the ends of the 12 grams helps protect the seals.  (Found with the first search I tried.)

Edited Addition:  The first fix I did to my Delta involved disassembling the piecing assembly and reassembling it without the pin and spring.  After this I dropped an o-ring down in the opening (all the way in to where the pin used to be) and seated by dummy 12 gram against that.  Since I didn't remove the 12 gram regularly it held fine once I got a good seal.


Edited by Mack - 03 September 2010 at 7:01pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tarrguy57 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2010 at 7:09pm
Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:

This isn't a bolt action, but it is cool.

Link

I've seen similar setups modified to truly be bolt-action operation but I don't remember where/can't find them right now.

I picked up a Delta .68 quite a while back for a very good price.  (Free--courtesy of a friend who owns a paintball store and was sick of sending it back in and getting it back still broken.)  The CO2 loading system is very poorly designed but there is a solution.  I wish I could claim the solution was my idea but it isn't; I found out from another forumer in a discussion on here.  A much better designed piercing/sealing system from another pistol is a drop in replacement for the system on the Deltas. 

I bought one, installed it and have had no further problems.  (With the exception that the quick release lever for the CO2 catches on the bottom of the holster and releases itself.)  If I can remember which pistol the part is from I will post it.  (Actually, I will just try a search for the thread.)

A simpler fix was suggested elsewhere by the forumer known as Flurry who says that smearing Chapstick on the ends of the 12 grams helps protect the seals.  (Found with the first search I tried.)

Edited Addition:  The first fix I did to my Delta involved disassembling the piecing assembly and reassembling it without the pin and spring.  After this I dropped an o-ring down in the opening (all the way in to where the pin used to be) and seated by dummy 12 gram against that.  Since I didn't remove the 12 gram regularly it held fine once I got a good seal.

those rifles look awesome.
man everyone has friends that just give them stuff. the last thing my friends gave me was...um...i can't even remember the last time i've gotten anything for free from my friends.
and better piercing assembly would be amazing but i'm attempting to come up with a bottom line. i have 2 and one has a bottom line on it already built straight into the gun w/o using a dummy cartridge. issue is the idiot machined off the entire area the 12g cartridges used to go in and pretty poorly at that. i just picked up basically brand new one. i wanna try and make a dummy bottom line system like the ones RAP4 makes for their pistols but hopefully mine won't cost $30-35 to make. 
from what you're saying thats what it sounds like you did. any further info? trying to piece together what your're saying with what i'm thinking and what i know. i know very little about gun mechanics which i why i have never bought parts for the internals of any guns i've owned
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2010 at 7:48pm
Found it!  It was the Rap4 puncture block--part #18.  (Probably the only decent part they ever made.)  Link to pertinent thread below:

Link

Originally posted by tarrguy57 tarrguy57 wrote:



those rifles look awesome.
man everyone has friends that just give them stuff. the last thing my friends gave me was...um...i can't even remember the last time i've gotten anything for free from my friends.

I met him when I started playing again after my last move and we became pretty good friends.  I hang out at his store about once a week and although I don't buy stuff all the time we end up BSing and I usually give him a hand while I'm doing so.  I especially enjoy tinkering so I end up doing marker maintenance occasionally while he deals with customers.  Over the years he's given me the Delta, one other marker, and a Q-Loader system, not to mention a bunch of smaller things.

and better piercing assembly would be amazing but i'm attempting to come up with a bottom line. i have 2 and one has a bottom line on it already built straight into the gun w/o using a dummy cartridge. issue is the idiot machined off the entire area the 12g cartridges used to go in and pretty poorly at that.

Well, I wouldn't bother with a new assembly for that one.  How the heck is the puncture area sealed so it doesn't leak?

i just picked up basically brand new one. i wanna try and make a dummy bottom line system like the ones RAP4 makes for their pistols but hopefully mine won't cost $30-35 to make. 
from what you're saying thats what it sounds like you did. any further info? trying to piece together what your're saying with what i'm thinking and what i know. i know very little about gun mechanics which i why i have never bought parts for the internals of any guns i've owned

My bottom line system resulted in the pistol no longer being holsterable.

This is what I did:
  • Removed the puncture assembly.  It has slots in the front and essentially just screws out although it is a pain to reach it with a tool.
  • Unscrewed the small piece (also slotted for a screwdriver) from the rear and took out the pin/spring assembly.
  • Replaced pin/spring with a small metal washer (to protect gas filter and provide a seat for the o-ring) and replaced the piece with the filter that was holding the pin/spring in place.
  • Inserted an o-ring in from the other side so it was right against the washer I just installed.
  • Put entire puncture assembly back into marker.  (Not a bad idea to check/replace the o-ring on this assembly and slightly lube it with a good paintball grease before doing so.)
  • Attached my bottom line set up by installing (and repeatedly adjusting fit of ) dummy 12 gram in 12 gram slot and screwing ASA to bottom of grip frame.
    • This consisted of the following: 
      • Dummy 12 gram which I got off e-bay.  (Fairly inexpensive and they work much better than making your own.)
      • Old ASA and stainless steel Tippmann hose from my spare parts bin.  (After 20+ years of playing there is a lot of stuff in this bin which saves trips to the store.)
      • You can use teflon tape or Locktite when making one of these.  I personally prefer teflon tape.
  • The final thing I did was put a small electrical zip tie around the 12 gram changer and quick release so it would stay in place.
The setup has changed a bit since this.  Since I could use 12 grams after installing the RAP4 part I experimented with those for a while.  The bottom line system has since gone back on because I'm planning on using this as the marker for the VIP when we do "Protect the President" games.  I'll stick a 13 cu. in. tank on it and give them a belt holder with 4 extra 10 round tubes so no one is out the cost of a 12 gram from loaning out their own main pistol.  (It also gives the VIP just a bit more firepower.)

I have one final mod in mind but haven't yet worked up the courage/motivation to really get started.  I have been kicking around the idea of widening the opening in the Delta magazine so that it would serve as a loading port.  My theory is then I could load by just locking the feed spring back, twisting the end plug 180*, and sticking a 10 round tube against the now open hole.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tarrguy57 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2010 at 11:58pm
Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:

Found it!  It was the Rap4 puncture block--part #18.  (Probably the only decent part they ever made.)  Link to pertinent thread below:

Link

Originally posted by tarrguy57 tarrguy57 wrote:



those rifles look awesome.
man everyone has friends that just give them stuff. the last thing my friends gave me was...um...i can't even remember the last time i've gotten anything for free from my friends.

I met him when I started playing again after my last move and we became pretty good friends.  I hang out at his store about once a week and although I don't buy stuff all the time we end up BSing and I usually give him a hand while I'm doing so.  I especially enjoy tinkering so I end up doing marker maintenance occasionally while he deals with customers.  Over the years he's given me the Delta, one other marker, and a Q-Loader system, not to mention a bunch of smaller things.

the guys at my shop are just too weird to hang out with. i shoot the breeze and stuff but they get mad when i joke about how high their prices are or don't buy stuff. only thing i got from them was maybe a few o-rings cuz i just needed a couple not a bag of 100

and better piercing assembly would be amazing but i'm attempting to come up with a bottom line. i have 2 and one has a bottom line on it already built straight into the gun w/o using a dummy cartridge. issue is the idiot machined off the entire area the 12g cartridges used to go in and pretty poorly at that.

Well, I wouldn't bother with a new assembly for that one.  How the heck is the puncture area sealed so it doesn't leak?

well ya not for my old one but the new one i just got. i'll take a picture and post it tomorrow. its ugly but it works

i just picked up basically brand new one. i wanna try and make a dummy bottom line system like the ones RAP4 makes for their pistols but hopefully mine won't cost $30-35 to make. 
from what you're saying thats what it sounds like you did. any further info? trying to piece together what your're saying with what i'm thinking and what i know. i know very little about gun mechanics which i why i have never bought parts for the internals of any guns i've owned

My bottom line system resulted in the pistol no longer being holsterable.

This is what I did:
  • Removed the puncture assembly.  It has slots in the front and essentially just screws out although it is a pain to reach it with a tool.
  • Unscrewed the small piece (also slotted for a screwdriver) from the rear and took out the pin/spring assembly. (i know this how process sucks!)
  • Replaced pin/spring with a small metal washer (to protect gas filter and provide a seat for the o-ring) and replaced the piece with the filter that was holding the pin/spring in place.
  • Inserted an o-ring in from the other side so it was right against the washer I just installed. (got a picture or diagram cuz i'm not quite following)
  • Put entire puncture assembly back into marker.  (Not a bad idea to check/replace the o-ring on this assembly and slightly lube it with a good paintball grease before doing so.)
  • Attached my bottom line set up by installing (and repeatedly adjusting fit of ) dummy 12 gram in 12 gram slot and screwing ASA to bottom of grip frame.
    • This consisted of the following: 
      • Dummy 12 gram which I got off e-bay.  (Fairly inexpensive and they work much better than making your own.) (mind telling me where you found these? all i can find are regular 12grams or threaded ones for bike pumps)
      • Old ASA and stainless steel Tippmann hose from my spare parts bin.  (After 20+ years of playing there is a lot of stuff in this bin which saves trips to the store.)
      • You can use teflon tape or Locktite when making one of these.  I personally prefer teflon tape. (ya the guy who made the bottom line on my other pistol used a white tape that he called pipe tape?)
  • The final thing I did was put a small electrical zip tie around the 12 gram changer and quick release so it would stay in place. (not a bad idea, did you just put it through one of the ports on the side or did you go all the way up and over the barrel)
The setup has changed a bit since this.  Since I could use 12 grams after installing the RAP4 part (what RAP4 part?) I experimented with those for a while.  The bottom line system has since gone back on because I'm planning on using this as the marker for the VIP when we do "Protect the President" games.  I'll stick a 13 cu. in. tank (never really understood 13ci tanks, nice and small and actually comfy but too expensive for how small they are. i've gotten 68ci tanks for the same price) on it and give them a belt holder with 4 extra 10 round tubes so no one is out the cost of a 12 gram from loaning out their own main pistol.  (It also gives the VIP just a bit more firepower.)

I have one final mod in mind but haven't yet worked up the courage/motivation to really get started.  I have been kicking around the idea of widening the opening in the Delta magazine so that it would serve as a loading port.  My theory is then I could load by just locking the feed spring back, twisting the end plug 180*, and sticking a 10 round tube against the now open hole. This would be really cool and way easier then trying to pull out the cap which so far i have been unable to do without pulling the mag off the gun and gripping it really hard (any ideas as to make this easier? i figure maybe sanding a small portion of the cap off all the way around) got a picture of what you're thinking. i understand the idea but not where
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2010 at 12:44am
Originally posted by tarrguy57 tarrguy57 wrote:

Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:

Found it!  It was the Rap4 puncture block--part #18.  (Probably the only decent part they ever made.)  Link to pertinent thread below:

Link

Originally posted by tarrguy57 tarrguy57 wrote:

i wanna try and make a dummy bottom line system like the ones RAP4 makes for their pistols but hopefully mine won't cost $30-35 to make. 
from what you're saying thats what it sounds like you did. any further info? trying to piece together what your're saying with what i'm thinking and what i know. i know very little about gun mechanics which i why i have never bought parts for the internals of any guns i've owned

If this is what you are referring to, it is very similar to what I made except theirs looks better because it is not mostly old/spare parts.

My bottom line system resulted in the pistol no longer being holsterable.

This is what I did:
  • Removed the puncture assembly.  It has slots in the front and essentially just screws out although it is a pain to reach it with a tool.
  • Unscrewed the small piece (also slotted for a screwdriver) from the rear and took out the pin/spring assembly. (i know this how process sucks!)
  • Replaced pin/spring with a small metal washer (to protect gas filter and provide a seat for the o-ring) and replaced the piece with the filter that was holding the pin/spring in place.
  • Inserted an o-ring in from the other side so it was right against the washer I just installed. (got a picture or diagram cuz i'm not quite following)  If I can find the old valve I'll try to put a picture up; for now I will just try to improve the description.  Imagine the piercing assembly put back together except the small washer is in place of the pin and spring.  I used an o-ring with an outer diameter about the same size as the inner diameter of the piercing assembly when you look at the end the 12 gram goes into.  I pushed that o-ring down inside where the pin used to be on the side the 12 gram goes in from.  When I put a 12 gram in the o-ring was between the neck of the 12 gram and the rest of the assembly.  Once tightened the o-ring (if the right size) will expand and form a seal.  It's not that useful for use with real 12 grams because it can fall out during changes.  However, for use with dummy 12 grams that will be left in place it works quite well.
  • Put entire puncture assembly back into marker.  (Not a bad idea to check/replace the o-ring on this assembly and slightly lube it with a good paintball grease before doing so.)
  • Attached my bottom line set up by installing (and repeatedly adjusting fit of ) dummy 12 gram in 12 gram slot and screwing ASA to bottom of grip frame.
    • This consisted of the following: 
      • Dummy 12 gram which I got off e-bay.  (Fairly inexpensive and they work much better than making your own.) (mind telling me where you found these? all i can find are regular 12grams or threaded ones for bike pumps)  This links to one very similar to what I purchased.  These are of a heavier material than actual 12 grams so there is significantly more threading available to attach hoses/plugs to.  The threading on mine was kind of rough but it works fine.
      • Old ASA and stainless steel Tippmann hose from my spare parts bin.  (After 20+ years of playing there is a lot of stuff in this bin which saves trips to the store.)
      • You can use teflon tape or Locktite when making one of these.  I personally prefer teflon tape. (ya the guy who made the bottom line on my other pistol used a white tape that he called pipe tape?)  Same thing as teflon tape; it can be found at almost any hardware store.
  • The final thing I did was put a small electrical zip tie around the 12 gram changer and quick release so it would stay in place. (not a bad idea, did you just put it through one of the ports on the side or did you go all the way up and over the barrel)  It was up over the top of the barrel.
The setup has changed a bit since this.  Since I could use 12 grams after installing the RAP4 part (what RAP4 part?) 

Click this link then click on the T68 Paintball Pistol Manual pdf file near the bottom of the list.  That will take you to a schematic of the pistol where you should check out part # 18.  It's been a while since I ordered mine but if I remember correctly part #19, the actual pin, is included when you purchase part # 18.  (I'd link directly but my computer (which is way overdue for replacement) doesn't do pdf pages anymore.

I experimented with those for a while.  The bottom line system has since gone back on because I'm planning on using this as the marker for the VIP when we do "Protect the President" games.  I'll stick a 13 cu. in. tank (never really understood 13ci tanks, nice and small and actually comfy but too expensive for how small they are. i've gotten 68ci tanks for the same price)

They are a bit pricey but I originally got them for pump play.  The lighter tank is very nice on my Phantom and is good for well over a 100 shots which is much more than I use when I run with the Phantom.

on it and give them a belt holder with 4 extra 10 round tubes so no one is out the cost of a 12 gram from loaning out their own main pistol.  (It also gives the VIP just a bit more firepower.)

I have one final mod in mind but haven't yet worked up the courage/motivation to really get started.  I have been kicking around the idea of widening the opening in the Delta magazine so that it would serve as a loading port.  My theory is then I could load by just locking the feed spring back, twisting the end plug 180*, and sticking a 10 round tube against the now open hole. This would be really cool and way easier then trying to pull out the cap which so far i have been unable to do without pulling the mag off the gun and gripping it really hard (any ideas as to make this easier?

One of the modifications I've seen others do to make removing the cap easier is drilling a small hole through the handle and putting a ring (like a key ring) through it.  If I was going to do this I would feel more comfortable if I had an extra cap on hand just in case the ring pulled through the material or something else went wrong.

i figure maybe sanding a small portion of the cap off all the way around)

I wouldn't recommend that.  If you take too much off the cap will be too loose and could come off when you don't want it to just from the pressure of the spring on the balls loaded in it.

 got a picture of what you're thinking. i understand the idea but not where 

When you look at the top of the magazine there is a oval hole near the rear of the mag just in front of the rear sight.  That is the hole I am thinking about enlarging.  One of the reasons I haven't done so yet is I want to make sure I only take off the metal I need to remove and no more.  A mistake here could interfere with the plug staying in place or even cause feeding stoppages.



To answer an earlier question that I overlooked.  I can't think of any replica pistols that use .68 caliber paintballs.  The paint size just interferes with effective copying of real pistol looks.  The closest you will probably come right now are the TPX and the Tiberius pistols.*

*Includes the Tiberius pistols marketed under other names such as the Blackbird and Tac-8.


Edited by Mack - 04 September 2010 at 12:58am
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If this is what you are referring to, it is very similar to what I made except theirs looks better because it is not mostly old/spare parts.

This is exactly what i want to make except since i don't have spare parts i'll be buying them new so maybe it'll come out nicer.

My bottom line system resulted in the pistol no longer being holsterable.

why is it no longer holsterable? i used a zeus holster (at least thats what i think it is, total piece of **edited**, doesn't stay on my leg at all but it fit the gun) and the gun fit just fine in there with my bottom line. i'm worried about the new special ops paintball LH deluxe holster i just ordered it it will fit. gotta hope!

This is what I did:
  • Removed the puncture assembly.  It has slots in the front and essentially just screws out although it is a pain to reach it with a tool.
  • Unscrewed the small piece (also slotted for a screwdriver) from the rear and took out the pin/spring assembly. (i know this how process sucks!)
  • Replaced pin/spring with a small metal washer (to protect gas filter and provide a seat for the o-ring) and replaced the piece with the filter that was holding the pin/spring in place.
  • Inserted an o-ring in from the other side so it was right against the washer I just installed. (got a picture or diagram cuz i'm not quite following)  If I can find the old valve I'll try to put a picture up; for now I will just try to improve the description.  Imagine the piercing assembly put back together except the small washer is in place of the pin and spring.  I used an o-ring with an outer diameter about the same size as the inner diameter of the piercing assembly when you look at the end the 12 gram goes into.  I pushed that o-ring down inside where the pin used to be on the side the 12 gram goes in from.  When I put a 12 gram in the o-ring was between the neck of the 12 gram and the rest of the assembly.  Once tightened the o-ring (if the right size) will expand and form a seal.  It's not that useful for use with real 12 grams because it can fall out during changes.  However, for use with dummy 12 grams that will be left in place it works quite well. i'll try and see if i can figure out what you mean. is this before or after you bought the #18 puncture seal assembly from RAP4? did you get it from RAP4 or else where? i can't seem to find it anywhere else for that cheap ($8.00+shipping)
  • Put entire puncture assembly back into marker.  (Not a bad idea to check/replace the o-ring on this assembly and slightly lube it with a good paintball grease before doing so.)
  • Attached my bottom line set up by installing (and repeatedly adjusting fit of ) dummy 12 gram in 12 gram slot and screwing ASA to bottom of grip frame.
    • This consisted of the following: 
      • Dummy 12 gram which I got off e-bay.  (Fairly inexpensive and they work much better than making your own.) (mind telling me where you found these? all i can find are regular 12grams or threaded ones for bike pumps)  This links to one very similar to what I purchased.  These are of a heavier material than actual 12 grams so there is significantly more threading available to attach hoses/plugs to.  The threading on mine was kind of rough but it works fine.Ya i actually just dug around and found those. not bad if i can get the braided line, fittings, and bottom line adapter for less that $8 (anything after that i might as well just spring for the RAP4 premade one)
      • Old ASA and stainless steel Tippmann hose from my spare parts bin.  (After 20+ years of playing there is a lot of stuff in this bin which saves trips to the store.)
      • You can use teflon tape or Locktite when making one of these.  I personally prefer teflon tape. (ya the guy who made the bottom line on my other pistol used a white tape that he called pipe tape?)  Same thing as teflon tape; it can be found at almost any hardware store.
  • The final thing I did was put a small electrical zip tie around the 12 gram changer and quick release so it would stay in place. (not a bad idea, did you just put it through one of the ports on the side or did you go all the way up and over the barrel)  It was up over the top of the barrel.
The setup has changed a bit since this.  Since I could use 12 grams after installing the RAP4 part (what RAP4 part?) 

Click this link then click on the T68 Paintball Pistol Manual pdf file near the bottom of the list.  That will take you to a schematic of the pistol where you should check out part # 18.  It's been a while since I ordered mine but if I remember correctly part #19, the actual pin, is included when you purchase part # 18. 

I experimented with those for a while.  The bottom line system has since gone back on because I'm planning on using this as the marker for the VIP when we do "Protect the President" games.  I'll stick a 13 cu. in. tank (never really understood 13ci tanks, nice and small and actually comfy but too expensive for how small they are. i've gotten 68ci tanks for the same price)

They are a bit pricey but I originally got them for pump play.  The lighter tank is very nice on my Phantom and is good for well over a 100 shots which is much more than I use when I run with the Phantom.

on it and give them a belt holder with 4 extra 10 round tubes so no one is out the cost of a 12 gram from loaning out their own main pistol.  (It also gives the VIP just a bit more firepower.)

I have one final mod in mind but haven't yet worked up the courage/motivation to really get started.  I have been kicking around the idea of widening the opening in the Delta magazine so that it would serve as a loading port.  My theory is then I could load by just locking the feed spring back, twisting the end plug 180*, and sticking a 10 round tube against the now open hole. This would be really cool and way easier then trying to pull out the cap which so far i have been unable to do without pulling the mag off the gun and gripping it really hard (any ideas as to make this easier?

One of the modifications I've seen others do to make removing the cap easier is drilling a small hole through the handle and putting a ring (like a key ring) through it. Ya i drilled a small hole for a chain and attached it to my cotter pin but i think i might shorten it and put a keyring on it.

i figure maybe sanding a small portion of the cap off all the way around)

I wouldn't recommend that.  If you take too much off the cap will be too loose and could come off when you don't want it to just from the pressure of the spring on the balls loaded in it. true i'll try a key ring and see if it can get it off easier with that

 got a picture of what you're thinking. i understand the idea but not where 

When you look at the top of the magazine there is a oval hole near the rear of the mag just in front of the rear sight.  That is the hole I am thinking about enlarging.  One of the reasons I haven't done so yet is I want to make sure I only take off the metal I need to remove and no more.  A mistake here could interfere with the plug staying in place or even cause feeding stoppages.
so long as you don't do it too close to the end of the mag (towards the quick release cap) it shouldn't be a problem. i might just try that on one of my spare mags. or i might try to make it big enough to shove a small hopper into it....hmmm to the drawing board!

[/QUOTE][/QUOTE] [/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2010 at 1:19am
Originally posted by tarrguy57 tarrguy57 wrote:


why is it no longer holsterable?

The pistol is no longer holsterable because the bottom line interfered with the two holsters I owned at the time that it would fit in.  (I was running it in shoulder holster mostly because the tactical holster would catch the dang CO2 release every time I took it out.)  As this is being set up for use as a primary, I am not going to worry about a holster for it anymore.  (Plus I sold the shoulder holster to someone who could use it more than I could; the pins in my back really hated that shoulder holster.)

i'll try and see if i can figure out what you mean. is this before or after you bought the #18 puncture seal assembly from RAP4?

I now understand your confusion regarding my solutions:

These are two different solutions that as I was offering you options.  The first solution I used was to take apart the stock Delta 68 piercing assembly and add a washer and o-ring as described above.  (This was before I learned about the part from RAP4.)  This worked well for the bottom line setup but not very well at all if I wanted to run off 12 grams.

Once I found out about the RAP4 part working in the Delta it became my second solution and replaced the original piercing assembly and everything I had done to it.  The RAP4 part is a drop in replacement and is the easiest solution.  In the original thread I believe the forumer who told me about it issued a warning about subpar velocity and a possible need for a spring upgrade afterwards but I had no such issues.

Basically, the things I did to the stock piercing/12 gram system are a cheaper alternative if you are only going to use a bottom line while the RAP4 part is the easier solution which allows either the use of a bottom line or 12 grams but is more expensive. 

did you get it from RAP4 or else where? i can't seem to find it anywhere else for that cheap ($8.00+shipping)

I got it from RAP4, I don't think I even looked anywhere else.

When you look at the top of the magazine there is a oval hole near the rear of the mag just in front of the rear sight.  That is the hole I am thinking about enlarging.  One of the reasons I haven't done so yet is I want to make sure I only take off the metal I need to remove and no more.  A mistake here could interfere with the plug staying in place or even cause feeding stoppages. so long as you don't do it too close to the end of the mag (towards the quick release cap) it shouldn't be a problem. i might just try that on one of my spare mags. or i might try to make it big enough to shove a small hopper into it....hmmm to the drawing board!

They used to make a hopper adapter for the PT series pistols.  It was pricey, but worked okay.  If you can find a picture of one it might provide additional ideas. 

Since you have spare mags . . . I might just wait for you to modify one and see how it turns out.  Big smile



Edited by Mack - 04 September 2010 at 1:24am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tarrguy57 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2010 at 2:28pm
Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:

Originally posted by tarrguy57 tarrguy57 wrote:


why is it no longer holsterable?

The pistol is no longer holsterable because the bottom line interfered with the two holsters I owned at the time that it would fit in.  (I was running it in shoulder holster mostly because the tactical holster would catch the dang CO2 release every time I took it out.)  As this is being set up for use as a primary, I am not going to worry about a holster for it anymore.  (Plus I sold the shoulder holster to someone who could use it more than I could; the pins in my back really hated that shoulder holster.)

ah ok ya i haven't had any issues with my holster. shoot forgot to take a pic. i'll try for tomorrow. also i now use a special ops paintball holster and it fits great in there with my bottom line.

i'll try and see if i can figure out what you mean. is this before or after you bought the #18 puncture seal assembly from RAP4?

I now understand your confusion regarding my solutions:

These are two different solutions that as I was offering you options.  The first solution I used was to take apart the stock Delta 68 piercing assembly and add a washer and o-ring as described above.  (This was before I learned about the part from RAP4.)  This worked well for the bottom line setup but not very well at all if I wanted to run off 12 grams.

Once I found out about the RAP4 part working in the Delta it became my second solution and replaced the original piercing assembly and everything I had done to it.  The RAP4 part is a drop in replacement and is the easiest solution.  In the original thread I believe the forumer who told me about it issued a warning about subpar velocity and a possible need for a spring upgrade afterwards but I had no such issues.

Basically, the things I did to the stock piercing/12 gram system are a cheaper alternative if you are only going to use a bottom line while the RAP4 part is the easier solution which allows either the use of a bottom line or 12 grams but is more expensive.  

so i'm gonna try and make my own so i should do the first option then right? not the RAP4 part?

did you get it from RAP4 or else where? i can't seem to find it anywhere else for that cheap ($8.00+shipping)

I got it from RAP4, I don't think I even looked anywhere else.

When you look at the top of the magazine there is a oval hole near the rear of the mag just in front of the rear sight.  That is the hole I am thinking about enlarging.  One of the reasons I haven't done so yet is I want to make sure I only take off the metal I need to remove and no more.  A mistake here could interfere with the plug staying in place or even cause feeding stoppages. so long as you don't do it too close to the end of the mag (towards the quick release cap) it shouldn't be a problem. i might just try that on one of my spare mags. or i might try to make it big enough to shove a small hopper into it....hmmm to the drawing board!

They used to make a hopper adapter for the PT series pistols.  It was pricey, but worked okay.  If you can find a picture of one it might provide additional ideas. 

never even heard of one. i've been looking at getting a Zeus G1/G2 hopper adapter but they run cheapest $30+shipping

Since you have spare mags . . . I might just wait for you to modify one and see how it turns out.  Big smile


I am considering it plus not only will reloading be easier, i might just make the hole big enough to hold a mini 50 round hopper too (even with a hole that big  it the reload cap would still keep the paintballs from falling out if i didn't use the hopper.) also if you want spare mags look on ebay, don't search for delta .68 mags, they run for $30 but search for PT extreme mags, closer to $15 i think
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2010 at 3:08pm
Originally posted by tarrguy57 tarrguy57 wrote:

Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:



I now understand your confusion regarding my solutions:

These are two different solutions that as I was offering you as options.  The first solution I used was to take apart the stock Delta 68 piercing assembly and add a washer and o-ring as described above.  (This was before I learned about the part from RAP4.)  This worked well for the bottom line setup but not very well at all if I wanted to run off 12 grams.

Once I found out about the RAP4 part working in the Delta it became my second solution and replaced the original piercing assembly and everything I had done to it.  The RAP4 part is a drop in replacement and is the easiest solution.  In the original thread I believe the forumer who told me about it issued a warning about subpar velocity and a possible need for a spring upgrade afterwards but I had no such issues.

Basically, the things I did to the stock piercing/12 gram system are a cheaper alternative if you are only going to use a bottom line while the RAP4 part is the easier solution which allows either the use of a bottom line or 12 grams but is more expensive.  

so i'm gonna try and make my own so i should do the first option then right? not the RAP4 part?

If you mean you are making your own bottom line the answer is "yes."  You should be able to make the bottom line work with the modifications to the existing puncture assembly and save yourself the cost of the part from RAP4.  Just keep in mind that you won't be able to use 12 grams with those modifications.  (When I said it doesn't work so well with 12 grams earlier, that was humorous understatement; 12 grams won't work at all with that mod due to the lack of a puncture pin.)

I did have to experiment with o-ring sizes a bit to get a good seal but I had a selection on hand from various other paintball and non-paintball related projects so that wasn't an issue for me.  (Thank goodness for ACE hardware.)

i might just make the hole big enough to hold a mini 50 round hopper too (even with a hole that big  it the reload cap would still keep the paintballs from falling out if i didn't use the hopper.)

Now it's my turn to be confused.  If you mod a magazine for a 50 round hopper, wouldn't you have to remove the end cap from it entirely?  How are you planning on getting the balls/hopper to stay securely in place.  (I can see if the hopper was all the way inside the mag the end cap wouldn't be needed but I'm not sure I'd trust a friction-fit for this on the field.)

also if you want spare mags look on ebay, don't search for delta .68 mags, they run for $30 but search for PT extreme mags, closer to $15 i think

I'm not certain I will need additional mags based on projected usage, but I will keep that in mind.


Edited by Mack - 04 September 2010 at 3:14pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tarrguy57 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 September 2010 at 4:19am
Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:

Originally posted by tarrguy57 tarrguy57 wrote:

Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:



I now understand your confusion regarding my solutions:

These are two different solutions that as I was offering you as options.  The first solution I used was to take apart the stock Delta 68 piercing assembly and add a washer and o-ring as described above.  (This was before I learned about the part from RAP4.)  This worked well for the bottom line setup but not very well at all if I wanted to run off 12 grams.

Once I found out about the RAP4 part working in the Delta it became my second solution and replaced the original piercing assembly and everything I had done to it.  The RAP4 part is a drop in replacement and is the easiest solution.  In the original thread I believe the forumer who told me about it issued a warning about subpar velocity and a possible need for a spring upgrade afterwards but I had no such issues.

Basically, the things I did to the stock piercing/12 gram system are a cheaper alternative if you are only going to use a bottom line while the RAP4 part is the easier solution which allows either the use of a bottom line or 12 grams but is more expensive.  

well i won't really care if i use 12g ever again. cost too much replacing o-rings and cartridges 8p

so i'm gonna try and make my own so i should do the first option then right? not the RAP4 part?

If you mean you are making your own bottom line the answer is "yes."  You should be able to make the bottom line work with the modifications to the existing puncture assembly and save yourself the cost of the part from RAP4.  Just keep in mind that you won't be able to use 12 grams with those modifications.  (When I said it doesn't work so well with 12 grams earlier, that was humorous understatement; 12 grams won't work at all with that mod due to the lack of a puncture pin.)

I did have to experiment with o-ring sizes a bit to get a good seal but I had a selection on hand from various other paintball and non-paintball related projects so that wasn't an issue for me.  (Thank goodness for ACE hardware.)

i'll have to see if i can figure this out or not

i might just make the hole big enough to hold a mini 50 round hopper too (even with a hole that big  it the reload cap would still keep the paintballs from falling out if i didn't use the hopper.)

Now it's my turn to be confused.  If you mod a magazine for a 50 round hopper, wouldn't you have to remove the end cap from it entirely?  How are you planning on getting the balls/hopper to stay securely in place.  (I can see if the hopper was all the way inside the mag the end cap wouldn't be needed but I'm not sure I'd trust a friction-fit for this on the field.)

i would have to remove the reload cap in order to use a hopper. i don't think it would be that big of an issue. kinda weary of trying it cuz i don't want to end up scrapping the entire mag

also if you want spare mags look on ebay, don't search for delta .68 mags, they run for $30 but search for PT extreme mags, closer to $15 i think

I'm not certain I will need additional mags based on projected usage, but I will keep that in mind.

makes reloads so much easier. i just played a game today with my new pistol and it is so much faster to remove the empty mag, put it in a slot on my holster, pull out a new mag, place it on, and shoot than to remove the reload cap, either count 10 rounds or use a 10 round tube, put the cap back on, then shoot. i've probably decreased my reload time drastically. trying to decided if i want one more mag (so i have 2 for each gun, and if i do it, 1 mag each modified to hold a hopper)

i'll get pics up later today of what i'm thinking and of my pistol with the butchered bottom line. gotta wait for imageshack to authorize my account which apparently takes "15 minutes" (its been 3 hours)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tarrguy57 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 September 2010 at 4:32pm
ok so here is a picture of what i'm thinking for the hopper fed mag.
(i don't know why but it keeps saying the image path/location doesn't exsist)
by drilling the hole where the red circle is the reload cap could still be used when the hopper isn't inserted. as for how it will stay, probably tape for now either around the feed tube or up and over the top of the hopper down to the gun.

here are some pics of my bottom line setup. yes i know it looks ugly as hell but it was free and cam with a 3.5 oz tank (i traded my silver delta that stood out like a sore thumb in the woods for this black one with a bottom line already installed and he gave me a 3.5oz tank to go with it)



Edited by tarrguy57 - 05 September 2010 at 4:34pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 September 2010 at 10:15pm
That's different (the bottom line set up), I really expected it to come into the valve from below.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 September 2010 at 12:44am
Well I got motivated enough to do some milling on the Delta 68 magazine.  It took all day since I only took off a little at a time and tested continuously, the feed hole probably still needs to be enlarged a bit, but upon testing it seems to work quite well and to not have caused any problems so far.
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