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An Asteroid wiped out dinosaurs...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ceesman762 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 12:15pm
Originally posted by Benjichang Benjichang wrote:

I'm just waiting until the stars are right again.

Cthulhu fhtagn

edit- WHERE IS YOUR GOD NOW?
The OTHER GODS....they still sleep......................
Innocence proves nothing
FUAC!!!!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bolt3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 12:22pm
Free Enterprise ....................

Evolution is not something that you can 'believe' or not.

It's science, you simply follow the facts.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 12:29pm
Originally posted by Bolt3 Bolt3 wrote:

Free Enterprise ....................

Evolution is not something that you can 'believe' or not.

It's science, you simply follow the facts.
 
Sorry, that is not true.
 
Where did life come from? No matter how hard evolutionist spin, that question is the problem with evolution. Either some humans are more "evolved" than others, as darwin believed (blacks were considered half-ape half human...) Which is glossed over in schools today as it is so outrageous.
 
But, life gives life, we don't see life just "happening" by itself. That can be tested, and has been for centuries. And through that study (ie science) we see that life just doesn't appear on its own.
 
Now, look at how many types of life are on the earth... Thousands, each with its OWN DNA. DNA doesn't allow a monkey to turn into anything but a monkey. Period. No  matter how many years you throw at it.
 
Are people that have science degrees and believe in Creationism, are they not scientists?...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 12:58pm
Breeding for genetic benefit is another example that proves that evolution has a weak foundation. My neighbor is a genetic farmer, who breeds Angus cows. These cows are bred to produce cows that have low offspring birth size that then grow very large, but the small calf at birth is key since most cows that are used in breeding large cows end up with large birth sizes, which result in more deaths during birth.
 
So, his cows are more valuable, and desirable, Does that mean he can breed one of them to become a dog?... Or a horse?... Of course not, and yet, that is what evolution is teaching, at some point, all of these animals came from something else, and turned into these complex animals...
 
Belief in that concept is a religion, one that is not to be questioned according to the large scientific bodies...
 
 
 
I see all of the life on earth and realize that a giraffe was created, there is no way that his neck just evolved because he liked leaves at the top of trees....
 
But, if you want to believe that evolution is real science then I guess you have no problem with man made global warming either... Both are being used to manipulate people to advance an agenda. And the agenda is to limit questions, and thought, just believe what you are told...
 
I prefer to think for myself.
 
Hmm, so they found soft tissue that was regenerated by adding water when they busted open 70,000,000 year old T-rex bones...
 
Maybe those bones aren't that old...
 
Naa, just keep believing the hype.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldpbnoob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 1:13pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

 
I prefer to think for myself.  
  So blindly following the bible is different than blindly following science how?
 
And the idea of God creating an "old" earth is ridiculous and a cop out to not being able to explain processes that obviously happened. I.E. glaciel movement over millions of years.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eville Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:28pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Originally posted by Bolt3 Bolt3 wrote:

Free Enterprise ....................

Evolution is not something that you can 'believe' or not.

It's science, you simply follow the facts.
 
Sorry, that is not true.
 
Where did life come from? 

For probably 567th time, this is not a question that evolution tries to answer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:35pm
Originally posted by Eville Eville wrote:

For probably 567th time, this is not a question that evolution tries to answer.
 
 
repeating something 567 times, that is wrong doesn't make the statement correct.
 
 
Evolution of life section states
 

Despite the uncertainty on how life began, it is generally accepted that prokaryotes inhabited the Earth from approximately 34 billion years ago.[2][229] No obvious changes in morphology or cellular organization occurred in these organisms over the next few billion years.[230]

The eukaryotes were the next major change in cell structure. These came from ancient bacteria being engulfed by the ancestors of eukaryotic cells, in a cooperative association called endosymbiosis.[99][231] The engulfed bacteria and the host cell then underwent co-evolution, with the bacteria evolving into either mitochondria or hydrogenosomes.[232] An independent second engulfment of cyanobacterial-like organisms led to the formation of chloroplasts in algae and plants.[233] It is unknown when the first eukaryotic cells appeared though they first emerged between 1.6  2.7 billion years ago.

The history of life was that of the unicellular eukaryotes, prokaryotes, and archaea until about 610 million years ago when multicellular organisms began to appear in the oceans in the Ediacaran period.[2][234] The evolution of multicellularity occurred in multiple independent events, in organisms as diverse as sponges, brown algae, cyanobacteria, slime moulds and myxobacteria.[235]

Soon after the emergence of these first multicellular organisms, a remarkable amount of biological diversity appeared over approximately 10 million years, in an event called the Cambrian explosion. Here, the majority of types of modern animals appeared in the fossil record, as well as unique lineages that subsequently became extinct.[236] Various triggers for the Cambrian explosion have been proposed, including the accumulation of oxygen in the atmosphere from photosynthesis.[237] About 500 million years ago, plants and fungi colonized the land, and were soon followed by arthropods and other animals.[238] Insects were particularly successful and even today make up the majority of animal species.[239] Amphibians first appeared around 300 million years ago, followed by early amniotes, then mammals around 200 million years ago and birds around 100 million years ago (both from "reptile"-like lineages). However, despite the evolution of these large animals, smaller organisms similar to the types that evolved early in this process continue to be highly successful and dominate the Earth, with the majority of both biomass and species being prokaryotes.[138]

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote __sneaky__ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:38pm
facepalm.
 
FE, before you try and bash evolution, can you please go read what it actually teaches?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote choopie911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:39pm
So making up an answer to the origin of life = better than trying to actually find out....go religion...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote __sneaky__ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:46pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Originally posted by Eville Eville wrote:

For probably 567th time, this is not a question that evolution tries to answer.
 
 
repeating something 567 times, that is wrong doesn't make the statement correct.
 
 
Evolution of life section states
 

Despite the uncertainty on how life began, it is generally accepted that prokaryotes inhabited the Earth from approximately 34 billion years ago.[2][229] No obvious changes in morphology or cellular organization occurred in these organisms over the next few billion years.[230]

The eukaryotes were the next major change in cell structure. These came from ancient bacteria being engulfed by the ancestors of eukaryotic cells, in a cooperative association called endosymbiosis.[99][231] The engulfed bacteria and the host cell then underwent co-evolution, with the bacteria evolving into either mitochondria or hydrogenosomes.[232] An independent second engulfment of cyanobacterial-like organisms led to the formation of chloroplasts in algae and plants.[233] It is unknown when the first eukaryotic cells appeared though they first emerged between 1.6  2.7 billion years ago.

The history of life was that of the unicellular eukaryotes, prokaryotes, and archaea until about 610 million years ago when multicellular organisms began to appear in the oceans in the Ediacaran period.[2][234] The evolution of multicellularity occurred in multiple independent events, in organisms as diverse as sponges, brown algae, cyanobacteria, slime moulds and myxobacteria.[235]

Soon after the emergence of these first multicellular organisms, a remarkable amount of biological diversity appeared over approximately 10 million years, in an event called the Cambrian explosion. Here, the majority of types of modern animals appeared in the fossil record, as well as unique lineages that subsequently became extinct.[236] Various triggers for the Cambrian explosion have been proposed, including the accumulation of oxygen in the atmosphere from photosynthesis.[237] About 500 million years ago, plants and fungi colonized the land, and were soon followed by arthropods and other animals.[238] Insects were particularly successful and even today make up the majority of animal species.[239] Amphibians first appeared around 300 million years ago, followed by early amniotes, then mammals around 200 million years ago and birds around 100 million years ago (both from "reptile"-like lineages). However, despite the evolution of these large animals, smaller organisms similar to the types that evolved early in this process continue to be highly successful and dominate the Earth, with the majority of both biomass and species being prokaryotes.[138]

Also, way to misinterpret the article. This never mentions how life got started in the first place. No serious evolutionist will tell you that is what evolution is about. That is abiogenises, not evolution. Evolutions strictly deals with the diversity of life, it has nothing to do with how life got started at the very beginning.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jmac3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 3:11pm
Originally posted by StormyKnight StormyKnight wrote:

Originally posted by jmac3 jmac3 wrote:

Am I the only who hates "based on polling"?

I could go to six different places, ask 1,000 people in each place the same question and "based on polling" a majority would be one way, a majority the other, and a majority would tell me to shut up.
Shut up.


...

Oh and FE your interpretation of evolution is a failure as usual.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kayback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 3:14pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Breeding for genetic benefit is another example that proves that evolution has a weak foundation. My neighbor is a genetic farmer, who breeds Angus cows. ...
So, his cows are more valuable, and desirable, Does that mean he can breed one of them to become a dog?... Or a horse?...


Of course he can't because his lifespan as a geneticist is what, 50 years? How many generations of cows is that? BUT you agree that he can get what he wants from his cows by manipulating their genes?

So if you take, say a WOLF, and manipulate it's genes, you'd get something that was closer to how you wanted it to be than how god made it. A dog perhaps?

If you took said cows, and selected them for their ability to run, and selectively bred those cows, over a long time you could end up with something that'll be similar to a horse. But I'm talking more than the 10 generations your farmer friend has available to him.

That is evolution. Forced evolution I'll admit, but it is evolution.

Take the lessons forced onto the animals by nature and the need to survive, throw in a coulpe of thousand generations and what do you get? Giraffes.

But again I get dragged back kickig and screaming.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eville Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 3:21pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Originally posted by Eville Eville wrote:

For probably 567th time, this is not a question that evolution tries to answer.
 
 
repeating something 567 times, that is wrong doesn't make the statement correct.
 
 
Evolution of life section states
 

Despite the uncertainty on how life began, it is generally accepted that prokaryotes inhabited the Earth from approximately 34 billion years ago.[2][229] No obvious changes in morphology or cellular organization occurred in these organisms over the next few billion years.[230]

The eukaryotes were the next major change in cell structure. These came from ancient bacteria being engulfed by the ancestors of eukaryotic cells, in a cooperative association called endosymbiosis.[99][231] The engulfed bacteria and the host cell then underwent co-evolution, with the bacteria evolving into either mitochondria or hydrogenosomes.[232] An independent second engulfment of cyanobacterial-like organisms led to the formation of chloroplasts in algae and plants.[233] It is unknown when the first eukaryotic cells appeared though they first emerged between 1.6  2.7 billion years ago.

The history of life was that of the unicellular eukaryotes, prokaryotes, and archaea until about 610 million years ago when multicellular organisms began to appear in the oceans in the Ediacaran period.[2][234] The evolution of multicellularity occurred in multiple independent events, in organisms as diverse as sponges, brown algae, cyanobacteria, slime moulds and myxobacteria.[235]

Soon after the emergence of these first multicellular organisms, a remarkable amount of biological diversity appeared over approximately 10 million years, in an event called the Cambrian explosion. Here, the majority of types of modern animals appeared in the fossil record, as well as unique lineages that subsequently became extinct.[236] Various triggers for the Cambrian explosion have been proposed, including the accumulation of oxygen in the atmosphere from photosynthesis.[237] About 500 million years ago, plants and fungi colonized the land, and were soon followed by arthropods and other animals.[238] Insects were particularly successful and even today make up the majority of animal species.[239] Amphibians first appeared around 300 million years ago, followed by early amniotes, then mammals around 200 million years ago and birds around 100 million years ago (both from "reptile"-like lineages). However, despite the evolution of these large animals, smaller organisms similar to the types that evolved early in this process continue to be highly successful and dominate the Earth, with the majority of both biomass and species being prokaryotes.[138]


Did you not read the first 7 words?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 3:33pm
Yes, and taken in context with the rest of the part I posted is clear that they are saying that the building blocks of life began somehow... as a goo that over billions of years became you and me, and all the other life on earth.
 
That is much more likely than God creating the earth and all of life...
 
 
 
as far as giraffes, I would like to know how they developed the system that allows them to raise and lower their heads and control their blood pressure so that their brain doesn't explode... Did the first giraffes just blow up their brains until they "evolved" that amazing system of valves in their necks? Or was it Created?...
 
 
and look at how evolution is touted in this article... Typical of all sources today, with a massive push about evolutions impact in our lives. No wonder 70% of biological scientists are athiests...
 
 
"Modifications to the giraffe's structure have evolved, particularly to the circulatory system. A giraffe's heart, which can weigh up to 10 kg (22 lb) and measure about 60 cm (2 ft) long, must generate approximately double the normal blood pressure for an average large mammal to maintain blood flow to the brain. In the upper neck, a complex pressure-regulation system called the rete mirabile prevents excess blood flow to the brain when the giraffe lowers its head to drink. Conversely, the blood vessels in the lower legs are under great pressure (because of the weight of fluid pressing down on them). In other animals such pressure would force the blood out through the capillary walls; giraffes, however, have a very tight sheath of thick skin over their lower limbs which maintains high extravascular pressure in the same way as a pilot's g-suit."


Edited by FreeEnterprise - 09 March 2010 at 3:38pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jmac3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 3:44pm
lrn2naturalselection.

The organism with the traits best suited for survival live, and the organism least suited dies.

This is to not say that the least suited organism couldn't have lived. So let's say a shorter necked species of giraffe was around. It may have been doing just fine. Longer necked ones were born but there was no reason for that trait to dominate as food at a low level was plentiful. Over time low food may have become scarce. The giraffes born with the longer necks were able to eat the trees that were taller. Over generations they reproduce offspring with the same trait, food becomes too scarce in small trees for the original short necks to survive and the long neck becomes fully dominant.

As for the valves, most species have a valve that allows it to control blood pressure...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eville Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 3:44pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Yes, and taken in context with the rest of the part I posted is clear that they are saying that the building blocks of life began somehow... as a goo that over billions of years became you and me, and all the other life on earth.
 

NO.  That article is saying the origins of life are unclear, so we are going to start at point B, after life already exists.  The whole goo part is being added in by you.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldpbnoob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 3:50pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

That is much more likely than God creating the earth and all of life...
 Yes. 
Much like Rebs post about some odd sound on a digital recorder. Is it more likely that some supernatural being from beyond came back to a haunted hotel to make some spooky sound at the exact moment they were recording.... or there was a glitch with the recorder?  Funny how you are so quick to embrace the logical explanation only when it suits your needs and doesn't conflict with your religious 'beliefs".

Edited by oldpbnoob - 09 March 2010 at 3:56pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote __sneaky__ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 4:02pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Yes, and taken in context with the rest of the part I posted is clear that they are saying that the building blocks of life began somehow... as a goo that over billions of years became you and me, and all the other life on earth.
 
The building blocks of life did begin somehow, otherwise none of us would be here.
 
That is much more likely than God creating the earth and all of life...
 
And yes, it is actually much more likely that all the complexity of life has a very smooth gradient to bring us more complex life instead of just starting and instantaneously, BAM! extreamily complex life. Plus you also have to explain how the even more complex being (God) came to be in the first place. You're solution is that he is above physical laws, which once again, as I mentioned earlier, removes him from the realm of science. (and thus, should stay out of classrooms.Big smile
 
I find it much more likely that we actually let science carry us the entire way through the process, instead of calling upon the supernatural which has 0 proof of existance.
 
as far as giraffes, I would like to know how they developed the system that allows them to raise and lower their heads and control their blood pressure so that their brain doesn't explode... Did the first giraffes just blow up their brains until they "evolved" that amazing system of valves in their necks? Or was it Created?...
 
Comments like this just further show how little you understand evolution. First of all, their circulatory system evolved right along with their necks, it didn't go "Okay neck, you become really long now! Alright done. Now then, circulatory system, your turn!" Their necks evolving was a very slow process, and the circulatory system required evolved at the exact same time, and the same rate. The giraffes who couldn't keep the blood circulating to their brains, did die, and their genes did not carry on. The giraffes who could do it, lived and passed their genes on.
 
Evolution does not have an intended aim, or result in mind. It is simply, if an organism has an advantage in survival in its environment, it is more likely to live, and reproduce to pass on its own genes. When the giraffes ancestors started to evolve their long necks, the giraffes with a neck slightly longer than the other giraffes around him had the advantage, and thus passed on his genes. Thats what natural selection is. It doesn't need an omnipotent being, it's just the drive of survival.
 
and look at how evolution is touted in this article... Typical of all sources today, with a massive push about evolutions impact in our lives. No wonder 70% of biological scientists are athiests...
 
I'm just going to keep my mouth shut...
 
 
"Modifications to the giraffe's structure have evolved, particularly to the circulatory system. A giraffe's heart, which can weigh up to 10 kg (22 lb) and measure about 60 cm (2 ft) long, must generate approximately double the normal blood pressure for an average large mammal to maintain blood flow to the brain. In the upper neck, a complex pressure-regulation system called the rete mirabile prevents excess blood flow to the brain when the giraffe lowers its head to drink. Conversely, the blood vessels in the lower legs are under great pressure (because of the weight of fluid pressing down on them). In other animals such pressure would force the blood out through the capillary walls; giraffes, however, have a very tight sheath of thick skin over their lower limbs which maintains high extravascular pressure in the same way as a pilot's g-suit."


Edited by __sneaky__ - 09 March 2010 at 4:05pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 4:23pm
FE, can you just answer one question for me?

How did God create life?  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ceesman762 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 March 2010 at 4:42pm
Originally posted by Darur Darur wrote:

FE, can you just answer one question for me?

How did God create life?  

By using Magic silly! God is Chris Angel ya know!
Innocence proves nothing
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