Tippmann Pneumatics Inc. Homepage
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Health Care Vote

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 4>
Author
oldsoldier View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Frequent target of infantile obsessives

Joined: 10 June 2002
Status: Offline
Points: 6544
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldsoldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Health Care Vote
    Posted: 16 January 2010 at 6:50pm
Does anyone have a link to this new Health Care bill? I know in this open and transparrent administration, we the represented must have made available a copy of the bill to read. I know Congress is in a hurry to pass 'the bill' my question is what is it and what does it contain. It appears no-one but Pelosi and Reid and the select few Dems writing it know what it actually contains. Hope Congress does take the time to read it before the 'vote', seeing that Brown from Mass may shatter the illusion.
Back to Top
High Voltage View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Fire in the disco

Joined: 12 March 2003
Location: 127.0.0.1
Status: Offline
Points: 14179
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote High Voltage Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 6:57pm
Back to Top
High Voltage View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Fire in the disco

Joined: 12 March 2003
Location: 127.0.0.1
Status: Offline
Points: 14179
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote High Voltage Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 6:58pm
Then there is OpenCongress.org. I trust you're smart enough to locate the bill using either of these two methods.
Back to Top
__sneaky__ View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Voted 2010 Most Improved Forumer

Joined: 14 January 2006
Location: Uncertain
Status: Offline
Points: 5285
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote __sneaky__ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 8:05pm
Originally posted by High Voltage High Voltage wrote:


Win.
"I AM a crossdresser." -Reb Cpl


Forum Vice President
Back to Top
oldsoldier View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Frequent target of infantile obsessives

Joined: 10 June 2002
Status: Offline
Points: 6544
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldsoldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 10:06pm
OK, lets try this again. The new bill being written combining both the House and Senate versions. You know the one the Dems are working on now, with no open door (C-Span) or Republicans allowed, true open and transparrent government. The old House and Senate Bills are being combined for the final version.
The one they are panicing on to get the vote before Brown ruins thier 'super majority'.

I do believe that is what congress is hoping for, people such as the try google posters who have no true idea on how a bill becomes law. Maybe refresh yourselves on some schoolhouse rock.

Edited by oldsoldier - 16 January 2010 at 10:09pm
Back to Top
Eville View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Strike 1 - 5/19, Filter-dodge

Joined: 19 September 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 3146
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eville Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 10:18pm
So you want a copy of a document that hasn't been written yet?  And you don't see how that is ridiculous?
Back to Top
jmac3 View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Official Box Hoister

Joined: 28 June 2004
Status: Offline
Points: 9201
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jmac3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 10:23pm
Originally posted by Eville Eville wrote:

So you want a copy of a document that hasn't been written yet?  And you don't see how that is ridiculous?
Que pasa?


Back to Top
slackerr26 View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar
Strike 2 - language, 8/20

Joined: 24 June 2008
Location: Russian Federation
Status: Offline
Points: 1697
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slackerr26 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 10:44pm
you would like a random collection of strangers scattered across the world to link you to a bill that is being written as we speak? ya serious?
Back to Top
Reb Cpl View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
2010 Worst Luck award winner

Joined: 10 June 2002
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14004
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Reb Cpl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 10:51pm
Originally posted by slackerr26 slackerr26 wrote:

you would like a random collection of strangers scattered across the world to link you to a bill that is being written as we speak? ya serious?


I think the entire point is that we haven't got a clue whats actually being written.

I understand that campaign promises have a habit of falling by the wayside, but something as simple as televising the proceedings for one of the most monumental pieces of legislation? The 'hush-hush' atmosphere of this whole thing sort of smells like they KNOW they're doing something that not only their opposition but the general populace would disapprove of, but don't give a rats ass.


Back to Top
Eville View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Strike 1 - 5/19, Filter-dodge

Joined: 19 September 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 3146
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eville Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 11:02pm
Because if they televised the whole process and told everyone every single thought that came to mind, then the jump on everything conservative pundits would be raising hell about something that might not even make it into the final bill.  Besides, this isn't a true democracy anyways.  You elected people to think for you.  Let them do their jobs.  If it gets passed without any public release, then fine, complain about it.  But until then, you have no grounds to complain.
Back to Top
Reb Cpl View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
2010 Worst Luck award winner

Joined: 10 June 2002
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14004
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Reb Cpl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 11:40pm
Originally posted by Eville Eville wrote:

Because if they televised the whole process and told everyone every single thought that came to mind, then the jump on everything conservative pundits would be raising hell about something that might not even make it into the final bill.  Besides, this isn't a true democracy anyways.  You elected people to think for you.  Let them do their jobs.  If it gets passed without any public release, then fine, complain about it.  But until then, you have no grounds to complain.


If that was any weaker, you wouldn't have posted at all.


Back to Top
Eville View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Strike 1 - 5/19, Filter-dodge

Joined: 19 September 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 3146
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eville Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 11:44pm
Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:

Originally posted by Eville Eville wrote:

Because if they televised the whole process and told everyone every single thought that came to mind, then the jump on everything conservative pundits would be raising hell about something that might not even make it into the final bill.  Besides, this isn't a true democracy anyways.  You elected people to think for you.  Let them do their jobs.  If it gets passed without any public release, then fine, complain about it.  But until then, you have no grounds to complain.


If that was any truer, you wouldn't have posted at all.
Back to Top
stratoaxe View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
And my axe...

Joined: 21 May 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 6831
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stratoaxe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2010 at 11:54pm

Wow.

Back to Top
mod98commando View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: 10 June 2002
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4423
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mod98commando Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2010 at 12:21am
I have to agree with Reb on this one. Even though Eville is right about the pundits doing backflips every time somebody from the other "team" says something, there's no reason that everything should take place behind closed doors. The pundits will spew their crap regardless of what information they have access to so that's no excuse to deprive the rest of us. You're basically saying that it would be bad to let people see what's going on because they might make a fuss about something that may not end up being meaningful later. Well, wouldn't that fuss be a good way to guide our representatives away from doing or wasting time on something that we don't want them to? Sounds to me like it would help politicians create something we actually agree with in the end.
oreomann33: Everybody invades Poland
Rofl_Mao: And everyone eats turkey
Me: But only if they're hungary
Mack: Yeah but hungary people go russian through their food and end up with greece on everyth
Back to Top
mbro View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Original Forum Gangster

Joined: 11 June 2002
Location: Isle Of Man
Status: Offline
Points: 10743
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mbro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2010 at 12:53am
Originally posted by mod98commando mod98commando wrote:

I have to agree with Reb on this one. Even though Eville is right about the pundits doing backflips every time somebody from the other "team" says something, there's no reason that everything should take place behind closed doors. The pundits will spew their crap regardless of what information they have access to so that's no excuse to deprive the rest of us. You're basically saying that it would be bad to let people see what's going on because they might make a fuss about something that may not end up being meaningful later. Well, wouldn't that fuss be a good way to guide our representatives away from doing or wasting time on something that we don't want them to? Sounds to me like it would help politicians create something we actually agree with in the end.
I don't condone closed sessions because I think it would lead to more insight by the electorate when they listen to actual negotiations by their rep as opposed to grand standing floor speeches, but, it is much more efficient. Less scrutiny gets deals done quicker. Even though that is off putting. What I'm really getting at is that congress is a bunch of elected whores.

Onto Obama'a promise for CSPAN, it's really nothing he can control. He can try to influence decisions in congress but he has no actual authority to enforce anything short of saying he won't pass a bill not negotiated in front of cspan, but that would mean no bill vs a **edited**ty bill that could be fixed in the mean time.

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
Back to Top
Gatyr View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Strike 1 - Begging for strikes

Joined: 06 July 2003
Location: Austin, Tx
Status: Offline
Points: 10299
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gatyr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2010 at 2:39am
Did the members of Congress campaign with the promise of transparency? I only recall Obama running on that promise, and if that's the case, it's politicians being politicians, and anyone singling out Democrats is being disingenuous and a partisan whore.
Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:

If that was any weaker, you wouldn't have posted at all.

The first part is most certainly true, especially with the (mis)information-super-highway tubes allowing any dinkus to say things as though his opinion actually carries anything valuable.
Back to Top
Reb Cpl View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
2010 Worst Luck award winner

Joined: 10 June 2002
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14004
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Reb Cpl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2010 at 9:52am
I don't know if I buy that there's nothing President Obama could have done to get these proceedings televised or at least have updates released on a regular basis to the people that this is going to effect.

I don't know how ANYONE regardless of party can shrug off the idea that after a bunch of secrecy these guys are going to come out of a room and say "ta-da!"




Back to Top
Eville View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Strike 1 - 5/19, Filter-dodge

Joined: 19 September 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 3146
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eville Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2010 at 12:31pm
You guys listen to way too much talk radio or something.  They have you convinced that standard procedure is now somehow an evil secret society plotting to sneak some doomsday bill through without telling anyone else about it.  They can't pass it without the rest of congress voting on it, which means the rest of congress will get to read it, which means it will have to be made public when it is done.  This way you guys can complain all you want about what is actually in the bill, rather than everything that might have at one time been scratched down on a restaurant napkin.  It will also cut down on the Rights ability to falsely claim that certain clauses are in the bill (death panels anybody?) when they aren't.  If they releases the bill at every step of the way it only cause more confusion about what made it into the final bill and what didn't (fueled no doubt by the likes of Limbaugh/Beck and company).
Back to Top
oldsoldier View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

Frequent target of infantile obsessives

Joined: 10 June 2002
Status: Offline
Points: 6544
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldsoldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2010 at 1:44pm
There has been a tendancy for congress to vote along party lines without the members even reading the legislation being voted on. If and when this bill clears the closed doors a vote will be hurried before many members will get a chance to read it. There is no hope for bipartisanship since the Republicans are locked out of the closed meeting where this bill is being written. And with Mass and Brown looming large a 'speed' vote is ensured before Brown if he wins can be seated. It does frighten me that many today show little interest in what Congress forces uopn the nation, and act as sheeple based on a 'trust' that this congress has forfieted many times over.

And yes it is supply and demand, increase the amount of people that can use the system, and with a defined amount of suppliers (doctors), yes rationing is inevitable. The VA is a classic example, since the cuts and the expanded number of eligable veterans the system providing benifits is collapsing. Just look at the come work for the VA commercials, the shortage of in house VA doctors and pharmisists which are now at critical levels with the Iraq/Afghan veterans flooding the financially limited system, resulting in delayed appointments and services (rationing the assets available).

Edited by oldsoldier - 17 January 2010 at 1:46pm
Back to Top
Reb Cpl View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
2010 Worst Luck award winner

Joined: 10 June 2002
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 14004
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Reb Cpl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2010 at 2:43pm
Originally posted by Eville Eville wrote:

You guys listen to way too much talk radio or something.  They have you convinced that standard procedure is now somehow an evil secret society plotting to sneak some doomsday bill through without telling anyone else about it.  They can't pass it without the rest of congress voting on it, which means the rest of congress will get to read it, which means it will have to be made public when it is done.


Now say "Baaaaa"

Its all too convenient for my liking.

Closed door (for all intents and purposes) proceedings with a sense of severe urgency to get this thing voted on and passed, while the possible 'deal breaker' vote hangs in the balance in MA? You really don't see any attempt to rule out contention before the vote can be made, with fingers crossed that Brown either loses in MA or they can get it done before he wins and throws a monkey wrench into the mix?

 


Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 4>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 10.03

This page was generated in 0.203 seconds.