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Global warming? (Yes, more)

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Reb Cpl View Drop Down
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    Posted: 03 December 2009 at 7:40pm
I know I'm violating a huge unspoken rule by starting this over again, but I didn't want to post this in that whirling crap-fest that the last GW thread had become, only to have it buried under a mound of insults and stupidity.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091121/ap_on_sc/eu_climate_hacked_e_mails


In short, for those of you that don't know about it already, a couple of hackers managed to get in and release a bunch of e-mails and documents from leading 'scientists' which blatantly discuss the hiding of data that points in the opposite direction of the global warming debate, and manufacturing numbers that support the theory of man-made global warming.

There are a ton of other links out there that are starting to surface, but a lot of them have their own slant to them, so I'll leave you to your own research, as I am still actively engaged in it myself.

What I'd like to know is, why isn't this a major news story? One of the defining debates of our time has potential evidence in one direction, and its ignored in favor of who Tiger Woods is dallying around with.

I'd like the opinions of some you leading forum minds, the rest of you can go play in the insult thread.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slackerr26 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 7:46pm
because the majority of people care more about american entertainment news than they do about whats happening worldwide
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Reb Cpl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 7:47pm
Originally posted by slackerr26 slackerr26 wrote:

because the majority of people care more about american entertainment news than they do about whats happening worldwide


I was hoping that wasn't the answer.

I'm sad now.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ParielIsBack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 7:50pm
I don't know about you, but I saw this on a bunch of major news outlets at the start of this week, and as early as late last week.

The (perhaps main) reason it's not major is partly because global warming is trendy.

The other reason is that  it doesn't change the vast majority of global warming data (although the models we already have don't predict the trends we've been seeing).


Edited by ParielIsBack - 03 December 2009 at 7:50pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slackerr26 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 7:51pm
Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:

Originally posted by slackerr26 slackerr26 wrote:

because the majority of people care more about american entertainment news than they do about whats happening worldwide


I was hoping that wasn't the answer.

I'm sad now.


your post reeks of sarcasm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Reb Cpl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 7:56pm
Originally posted by slackerr26 slackerr26 wrote:

Originally posted by Reb Cpl Reb Cpl wrote:

Originally posted by slackerr26 slackerr26 wrote:

because the majority of people care more about american entertainment news than they do about whats happening worldwide


I was hoping that wasn't the answer.

I'm sad now.


your post reeks of sarcasm


You misread, I wasn't trying to be sarcastic, I was trying to be ironic.

LOL

....and I just heard this today on the morning radio program I listen to- and they got it from The daily show, (BAAWWWW, NOT REAL NEWS!) and it sounded interesting enough that I started digging on my own.
If this IS all true, then what 'data' do we have on that side of the fence that we can be positive isn't also fabricated? You're talking about the possibility that scientific data was completely spun out of nothingness in order to support a political and financial agenda.

And...what other evidence? As Whale keeps mentioning, "Global Warming" is something of a misnomer now, yet there are still plenty of claims that the planet is warming up- claims made by the same people who cannot explain the decade of steadily DROPPING global temperature. Claims propped up, more than likely by the data created by the very people referenced in these e-mails that are being exposed.






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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ammolord Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 8:20pm
Well, iv got a paper due on Global warming monday, guess i know where il come for help.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FROG MAN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 8:44pm
I have been so busy in my own little world of studying I havnt had time to keep up on any global warming debate. The reason I am commenting is, one of my proffs has to PHD's in climate modeling and something else climate related.

Now I cant speak for her, but she constantly talks about global warming during the middle of our lectures.  She has repeatedly said anyone who doesn't believe in global warming are idiots. Now thats not my opinion and being a highly educated person I am sure most of you understand why she is so arogant.

My personal opinion is that the advances and progress in alternate energy solutions and cleaner idustry is great. Wether the planet is getting warming due to humans or not, garbage ,polution and smog is still out of control.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 9:41pm
They tremble at my name...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 9:56pm
if you will only read one article about this...
 
Read this one.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote choopie911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 10:05pm
Yeah, I've said it was a misnomer or pile of junk for years. Just like last thread: seasonal climate differences != massive world screwover
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote slackerr26 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 10:39pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mbro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 10:48pm
As I said in the previous thread, pumping ungodly amounts of carbon dioxide due to combustion into the atmosphere probably isn't a good idea one way or another. Granted there is an initial cost to switching to more renewable and clean energy sources in the long run i will pay out in dividends due to the lack of future investment required per unit of energy.

Renewable is the future and it is in our best interest to skew the market now to make it attainable sooner rather than later.

This is still true regardless of whatever emails surface.

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rofl_Mao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 10:51pm
nuclear = best
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 December 2009 at 11:51pm
I think . . . . oh wait a minute . . . I'm supposed to be in the other thread.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gatyr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 December 2009 at 12:33am
I considered posting my thoughts in the other thread, but decided against it. I'll try here:

My biggest problem with reaching any conclusions that are not basically restatements of the e-mails themselves is that they are being read with absolutely no context, no order, and with no comparable understanding of global (or of any sort of) climatology.

Yes, there is some rather damning things said in the e-mails, but plenty of things can seem more damning than they are without sufficient knowledge. Moreover, it looked as though the people writing the e-mails were worried about people not fully comprehending the science and, given the volatility of the subject, wanted to avoid significant public backlash that would stem from a lack of understanding. This resulted in the collusion we see in the e-mails.

Plus, the silencing opponents thing isn't a concern at all for me. I have no doubts in my mind that a significant number of scholars secretly think to themselves shortly before writing a response to something "how can I most thoroughly make this person look like a donkey?" What showed through in the e-mails is, at my glance, unprofessionalism of a professional sort that comes out when one believes the actions/words will not be revealed.

I'm not trying to say they aren't at fault, or there aren't any shady dealings or anything, but condemning them and global warming because of this is jumping the gun a bit. Though it is at least not irrational to have that knee-jerk reaction.
Originally posted by slackerr26 slackerr26 wrote:

Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

good article with facts...
 



Even though that doesn't necessarily mean there is nothing factual in the article, that's still hilarious. Good find.


Edited by Gatyr - 04 December 2009 at 12:35am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 December 2009 at 12:04pm
To sort of piggy-back off of what Mbro said:

Trying to maintain the environment, strive for sustainability and cleaner energy should be ideals of everybody who has to live on this planet, no matter your political leaning.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldsoldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 December 2009 at 7:32pm
Yea, I remmember the "new Ice Age' dire warnings in the 70's authored by some of the same individuals. The followers were still up in arms until another cause de juer appeared in the form of 'Global Warming' and they totally reversed thier belief in the 'New Ice Age" to remain trendy.

Clean energy is good, using the cause for a political/economic agenda is wrong. When some poor slob in some third world nation has to cut his wood burning (the only means of heat/cooking)by government mandate (due to this or that treaty) while Al Gore and crew fly/drive around the world preaching energy awareness this whole topic is hyprocracy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kayback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 December 2009 at 7:48pm
My latest fad is calling vegans hypocrites for using gasoline powered cards. Great fun all round.

Apparently it is OK to use animal products if they died "a long time ago". In my books that's a sliding scale, this steak died "a long time ago", now shut up.

I thought it would give them another reason to want to ban cars and their carbon contribution. Oh well.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IrIsHGunNeR37 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 December 2009 at 7:49pm
With global warming being an issue it is hard to deny some of the facts. Personally I feel even though human role in the industrial facotr dosen't help the situation of global warming, it is important to remember the fact that the earth does go through heating and cooling cycles. So though it is impossible to say it is one or the other it would seem that a combination of the two help play a role in producing the results that have been gathered by scientists.
 
Thats all I have as far as trying to sound intelligent goes tonight.


Edited by IrIsHGunNeR37 - 04 December 2009 at 7:49pm
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