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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kayback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 5:20am
Tour De France also takes 23 days. A decent speedball game is over in under 23 minutes......

I honestly don't know about it being televised. I've seen some and it is generally "ok" but nothing I'd really watch religeously.

With other sports, like said before, there is one thing to watch. It's generally something that you have to show a lot of dazzling skill to keep or to get to.

Paintball is just too fragmented. Even if you play center flag or something, and there is always only one thing to watch, it is still fragmented.

The interaction is remote. Not many other games allow people 100 yards away to tag out their opponents. All the other sports require you to be right there, literally where the action is, to be able to do something.

While there are things like long passes in NFL, you can still follow the action (the ball). In Paintball you could be watching the flag, whlie the backers are hosing their angles and they get 2 eliminations, without you actually seeing it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ParielIsBack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 9:03am
Again, paintball has been around as long as BMX, although probably not quite as long as skateboarding.

The difference between both of those and paintball is that one weekend of paintball costs as much as a skateboard or a BMX bike, and far more kids got into both than will ever pay for paintball.

*EDIT* Perhaps I should point out that I have some experience in this area -- I compete in a sport that is about three centuries old give or take a few decades, yet has no truly professional athletes.  Many of the same reasons apply: it's expensive, and there's not much focused action (with a minimum race length of a mile and a quarter).


Edited by ParielIsBack - 19 November 2009 at 9:07am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote usafpilot07 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 10:31am
Originally posted by jmac3 jmac3 wrote:


What is happening in woodsball game that makes it more exciting to watch than an xball match? And I use Xball because 7man is stupid and slow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gatyr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 11:33am
Originally posted by usafpilot07 usafpilot07 wrote:

Originally posted by jmac3 jmac3 wrote:


What is happening in woodsball game that makes it more exciting to watch than an xball match? And I use Xball because 7man is stupid and slow.
Hey now!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 12:26pm
Originally posted by Mack Mack wrote:

Originally posted by mbro mbro wrote:

My reason for thinking paintball will never get as big as other sports: Lack of central focus point. Everyone is shooting at everyone. You're not following a ball around or a guy on a bike. Everything is happening all at once.


^^^This.

While woodsball could have a focal point (the flag) I have seen numerous games where all the action happens away from the flag and it is picked up as an afterthought by the survivors once all of their opponents have been eliminated. 

Helmet/strategically placed cams might catch enough action to make the game interesting to watch, but without heavy editing it couldn't be presented as a coherent set of events.  Once the editing is done, the game is no longer "live" which can relate to loss of interest in watching anything other than highlights. 

BMX has a focal point where the action is automatically located (the rider currently competing) paintball doesn't.  It is just the nature of the sport.  However, since we are having this discussion, I am curious if anyone has ideas for format changes that might make paintball (woods or speed) more TV friendly.

My thoughts: (related to woods/scenario)
  • Smaller teams
  • Specific scenario based
  • Gun, as opposed to helmet, cams
  • Urban setting (possibly a single street with one-level "roofless" buildings to aid in filming--a large warehouse where overhead walks for cameramen would be good)
  • Bright paint with distinctive colors for each team
  • Larger caliber paint for bigger splats
  • Hard vests/no padding to ensure breaks
Even so, I can't see the necessary expenses required for an enjoyable production being recouped.

(Hmmm . . . what about Laser Tag type fields?)


 
 
I don't think it would work live...
 
 
But, why would it need to be live?
 
I'm thinking more of a survivor type thing. There was a movie I saw a while ago where people would get dropped off on an island and they had cameras all over it to capture the footage, and the guys went out and killed each other (they were all killers from death row). The public would watch and it made me think, if you applied that same video work to paintball it could be an amazing show.
 
I don't think limiting it to just one camera per player makes sense.
 
If you are going to edit it anyway... Go multicamera.
 
I play with two cameras currently, just for this reason. I have a helmet cam, and also a gun cam. My gun camera doesn't have zoom currently, but I would like to add that to it, so that I can have it zoomed in on the targets, while the helmet cam gets the regular footage. It takes thinking about it to get decent footage, but I've only been doing it a year, and I think I've gotten some decent stuff. One day I will edit together some of my footage into a good video... I just haven't had time yet.
 
 
 
but, back to my point, I think if you did a show, and the first half of the show was bio's on the guys playing, then did the actual event, with the action only edited together, a woodsball/scenario could really work well on tv.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 12:33pm
Originally posted by ParielIsBack ParielIsBack wrote:

The difference between both of those and paintball is that one weekend of paintball costs as much as a skateboard or a BMX bike, and far more kids got into both than will ever pay for paintball.

 
How much do you think a good bmx bike costs?
 
 
If you are comparing the price of a skateboard to a high end bmx... You have the wrong idea.
 
My cranks on my last bmx cost over $400... Plus bearings $100 plus pedals $85 plus chainring $65
 
Thats over $650 for just the crankset... Add a ti chain... ti frame...
 
You could easily spend $3,000+ on a good ti freestyle bike.
 
Shoot, I had over $2,500 just in my paintjob on my last bike...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Troopr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 12:41pm
Originally posted by FROG MAN FROG MAN wrote:

...but remember when something becomes your job it loses its fun. So embrace the fact that you are unable to paintball as your career and enjoy it as a sport as long as you can.
/agree a very good point...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoboCop Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 12:50pm
FE- $2500 on paint, on a bike? You sir are dumb for spending that much money on just a paint job.

A starter set on a bike is plenty cheap enough. Start modding it and it's going to be about the same price as a high end paintball marker. Buying new parts, boards, bolts, trigger frames. It's all relativistic. But playing paintball is still more expensive as you have to keep dishing out money everytime you go play.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ParielIsBack Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:05pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Originally posted by ParielIsBack ParielIsBack wrote:

The difference between both of those and paintball is that one weekend of paintball costs as much as a skateboard or a BMX bike, and far more kids got into both than will ever pay for paintball.

 
How much do you think a good bmx bike costs?
 
 
If you are comparing the price of a skateboard to a high end bmx... You have the wrong idea.
 
My cranks on my last bmx cost over $400... Plus bearings $100 plus pedals $85 plus chainring $65
 
Thats over $650 for just the crankset... Add a ti chain... ti frame...
 
You could easily spend $3,000+ on a good ti freestyle bike.
 
Shoot, I had over $2,500 just in my paintjob on my last bike...


But the 12-year old BMX rider or skateboarder spends $200 to ride for a year, or more.

Also, I've never heard of a $2500 bike paintjob before right now, even from pro-cyclists.  What did they paint it with, gold?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote God Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:15pm
A Walmart board can cost 20 bucks but a custom board, (wheels, trucks, bearings, grip tape) is going to cost in the 100's. Depending on how much you skate and how hard, a skater can easily go through a few boards a week. Some pros can go through boards in a day. Then there are shoes, hospital bills, surgery, tickets, bail. It can add up just as easily. 

All sports needs to do to make tons of money is grab the attention of the globe and force it down their throats. If paintball were to do the same, there would be just a much money as in the other professional sports. The money doesn't come from televised media events, at least not in the short term, it is the mass recognition and sales of the sport's products and popularity of the sports top players. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:27pm
Originally posted by ParielIsBack ParielIsBack wrote:

Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Originally posted by ParielIsBack ParielIsBack wrote:

The difference between both of those and paintball is that one weekend of paintball costs as much as a skateboard or a BMX bike, and far more kids got into both than will ever pay for paintball.

 
How much do you think a good bmx bike costs?
 
 
If you are comparing the price of a skateboard to a high end bmx... You have the wrong idea.
 
My cranks on my last bmx cost over $400... Plus bearings $100 plus pedals $85 plus chainring $65
 
Thats over $650 for just the crankset... Add a ti chain... ti frame...
 
You could easily spend $3,000+ on a good ti freestyle bike.
 
Shoot, I had over $2,500 just in my paintjob on my last bike...


But the 12-year old BMX rider or skateboarder spends $200 to ride for a year, or more.

Also, I've never heard of a $2500 bike paintjob before right now, even from pro-cyclists.  What did they paint it with, gold?
 
Actually, yes. Gold, silver, and bronze leaf work, but the cost was in the artist who applied all the custom work to it.

It turned out awesome, and is by far the coolest bmx bike ever (in my opinion).
 
Is spending a fortune rebuilding a car, that will only be worth so much when you are finished... no matter what you spend dumb?...
 
Its all relative. I wanted to do it, so I did.
 
Lemme pull some pics.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldpbnoob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:28pm
I found both videos to be substantially boring after a minute or so. I also find it boring to watch; Nascar, golf, bowling, most olympic events, hunting, fishing, figure skating, baseball, curling, grass growing, cycling, running, and even a lot of real sports on TV as well. I would have to agree that the mass appeal of paintball just isn't there from a spectators perspective. Heavy editing might make it more interesting for people that enjoy the game, but I just don't see a big draw for non-enthusiasts. I can watch snowboarding, bmx and some other Xgames type events, but even those can become redundant after awhile. But as mentioned, there is a whole lot more exitement in watching  Mat Hoffman catch 20+ feet of air off the top of a halfpipe than watching some guys playing paintball. And I would argue that a lot of people only find the BMX interesting in the hopes of seeing the rider bust his .... Much like people watching racing mainly to see if someone hits the wall at 180+. Look at even the difference between BMX racing and BMX freestyle. Racing get little if any airplay, while trick riding gets plenty of it. Even in Motocross, more emphasis has been put on the freestyle events than the actual racing. People want to be wowed, just won't happen in paintball in the foreseeable future.

Edited by oldpbnoob - 19 November 2009 at 1:31pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jmac3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:32pm
I do believe paintball has tried.

Hell it's pretty much been on TV since like 1996 with a woodsball tournament shown on ESPN. There was also an OLD tournament filmed at Disney for ESPN in an urban type setting.

They then had NPPL Super 7 on ESPN2 I believe. There was also the college national on one the Fox channels.


There was beyond the paint on one of the fox channels, and the PB2X tv show. Smart Parts had a professional only xball tournament at Mohegan Sun and also aired that on TV.

William Shatner promoted it for his game, and countless celebrities have played(Ken Griffey Jr. Ego anyone?)

Also, the NXL was the push for TV coverage. They had Dick Clark's company involved.

Are you going to tell me after all this you can think of a better way to make it a mainstream sport with truly paid pros?


Edited by jmac3 - 19 November 2009 at 1:34pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:33pm
Whoops, wrong bike... That is my friend catfish's old bike.
 
Here it is.
 
 
 
I shot those pics and was the rider... (seven second timer on my camera)
 
Hold on, I'll upload some of just the bike
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jmac3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:39pm
FE, you should just show up to skate parks and do random tricks on your ridiculous bike while wearing a suit.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ceesman762 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:42pm
FE,
what is your opinion on a Mongoose?  back in our day they were the IT thing to have. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:45pm
Originally posted by jmac3 jmac3 wrote:

I do believe paintball has tried.

Hell it's pretty much been on TV since like 1996 with a woodsball tournament shown on ESPN. There was also an OLD tournament filmed at Disney for ESPN in an urban type setting.

They then had NPPL Super 7 on ESPN2 I believe. There was also the college national on one the Fox channels.


There was beyond the paint on one of the fox channels, and the PB2X tv show. Smart Parts had a professional only xball tournament at Mohegan Sun and also aired that on TV.

William Shatner promoted it for his game, and countless celebrities have played(Ken Griffey Jr. Ego anyone?)

Also, the NXL was the push for TV coverage. They had Dick Clark's company involved.

Are you going to tell me after all this you can think of a better way to make it a mainstream sport with truly paid pros?
 
 
Yes, I can think of much better ways... And I'm positive with enough money it could be successful fast.
 
But, since money is the trick... It will take time.
 
Do you think BMX just became successful because a rider got a corporate company to start "something big"?...
 
Trust me, there were many growing pains.
 
It took the guys that loved the sport to make it what it is today. Then when it started getting popular again (from these riders sinking everything they had into it) then corporate giants started getting involved as they couldn't ignore it anymore.
 
paintball could do the same thing, but waiting for someone else to do it is always the problem.
 
 
 
YOU have to do it yourself. If it doesn't work, try again. If that doesn't work, try again.
 
Trust me, I would never have invented a trick like this, if I quit the first time I tried it and fell...
 
 
lazy man hang 5 performed by one of my friends named Kip.
 
 
 
It took so many crashes until I could do it consistently that it isn't even funny.
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldpbnoob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2009 at 1:46pm
Webco, DG and Mongoose were all the shiznit when I was a kid. You can find Mongoose at Walmart nowadays.
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