Tippmann Pneumatics Inc. Homepage
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Change?... yeah, right.

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 4567>
Author
FreeEnterprise View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Not a card-carrying member of the DNC

Joined: 14 October 2008
Location: Trails Of Doom
Status: Offline
Points: 4779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 7:41am
History gives us lots of suggestions.
 
Lets look at what caused this recession. In my opinion, the way Americans lived in debt and bought so much with money they didn't have caused the housing market to continue skyrocketing. But, that was a house of cards. There wasn't real money there. Just like the internet stocks a while back. When you start valuing things based on what you think the future holds... You are going to fail.
 
During the "good" times, the government forced banks to make bad loans, because as Bill Clinton stated, "Everyone deserves the American dream".
 
Which is not true. People that work hard, and keep working hard, will achieve the American dream, but people that are lazy and don't want to work. They will not.
 
But, loans were made anyway. And then when the oil prices went up, and people had to choose between getting to work, or paying their mortgages... The housing market started falling.
 
Greed.
 
Which is normal in business, the frustrating part right  now is that government is doing the exact same thing again and expecting different results. When entities get greedy, they get smacked. The market kills them. (look at the banking stocks). Propping them up will only drag out the end result.
 
Besides, if you have companies that have been unethical, and run their value into the ground by doing greedy things to "increase" their value on paper. And then they get called on it, as their stock value plummets. Why would you then put MORE money in their control? They have proven to be incapable of trust. Well, at least we cut their pay... (yeah, that will make them start to do the right thing...)
 
Kind of like how the government bailed out GM. Everyone knows GM has had problems way before the economic turndown. They take way too long to get cars to market, (unions...) I wanted to buy a new camaro back when they said they were coming out... (remember, back in 2002...) Still not available, and now they are going to make it in Canada. Sorry Canada, for me, an "American" sports car has to be built in America for me to buy it. I will keep driving my Acura built in Ohio.
 
So now the government gave these companies money, and now they are limiting the income the executives can receive. And putting MORE cafe standards on the cars they make... Yeah, thats effective at selling cars...
 
That is wrong. How do they get the talent they need to turn the companies around when they are capped at $500,000. This is not a decision of government... But, yet, here we are...
 
If government wants typical Americans to think they too are not about greed, (hard to ignore). They could stop with all the babysitting and let free markets do what they do. If the head of the treasury can't figure out how to pay his taxes correctly, then the tax structure is bad, and needs to be changed (and he is corrupt, and greedy). And why is Pelosi still flying around in her private jet, when she doesn't even think executives at large companies should have planes...  She doesn't even know how many Americans there are... (remember 500,000,000 Americans will lose their jobs by next month, according to her). Look at the congresses approval ratings. And yet they just got a huge raise... Hmm. How many people get raises for doing a bad job?
 
 
Government needs to cut taxes.
Government needs to cut itself in half. It has grown so large it is killing the economy.
 
When Barak said "only government can get us out of this mess".
 
He was wrong. America is made up of small buisness, all of my friends that are small business owners like myself are laying people off because we are done with free enterprise in this country.
 
Until we get back to that, the market won't recover, and the value of a dollar will continue to decline.
 
Its all a ponzi scheme.
 
And we will ALL pay.
Back to Top
Predatorr View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Strike 1 - Rules 1 and 2

Joined: 28 January 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 3795
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Predatorr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 7:50am
You're a fool.  Smart, but a fool.

Take an economics course, for the love of God.  You talk about spending while in debt.  A major key of Keynesian Economics; a proven method, mind you. 

You also talk about your American car made in Canada?  The profit made on that car still goes into the GDP of the United States.  There's a lot more I could write on this and maybe I'll edit later, as I've yet to go to sleep. I'll look at my Macro notes and get back to you. 
Back to Top
FreeEnterprise View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Not a card-carrying member of the DNC

Joined: 14 October 2008
Location: Trails Of Doom
Status: Offline
Points: 4779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 8:02am
Originally posted by Predatorr Predatorr wrote:

You're a fool.  Smart, but a fool.

Take an economics course, for the love of God.  You talk about spending while in debt.  A major key of Keynesian Economics; a proven method, mind you. 

You also talk about your American car made in Canada?  The profit made on that car still goes into the GDP of the United States.  There's a lot more I could write on this and maybe I'll edit later, as I've yet to go to sleep. I'll look at my Macro notes and get back to you. 
 
See, and here is the rub. (actually I've taken quite a few economics courses...)
 
People make statements that they can't back up.
 
Keynesian economics is not proven. It is theory. And bad theory at that.,,
 
I can hear you now..."Oh, Free, you can't prove that..."
 
Wanna bet?
 
What is the interest rate right now?
 
0.
 
Did it fix anything?
 
No.
 
How much lower can they make it?
 
uh, they can't its done... unless we change math... Or devalue the currency... (oh, wait, that is exactly what they are doing)
 
We are coming out of a war, where we spent more money than ever before.
 
$594,323,000,000.00 +
 
 
Exactly what that weak theory calls for... And yet, the recession is just getting worse.
 
 
See, this is the problem with having a broken world view. Either nothing matters and you believe that everything just evolved. Or you believe in absolutes, that God Created the world, and we should do our best in everything we do, to the glory of Him.
 
Spending money you don't have and putting that burden on your future generations is not the way out of an economic mess.
 
Saving for the rainy day is. The Bible says to work and save.
 
Secular humanists, say survival of the fittest. So you better spend all you have and then some, so that your are in a "better" position than your neighbor...
 
You all have been sold a bill of goods that is wrong. And yet, you don't question it. You just follow along, figuring someday someone will figure it out and everything will be rosy...
 
Back to Top
FreeEnterprise View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Not a card-carrying member of the DNC

Joined: 14 October 2008
Location: Trails Of Doom
Status: Offline
Points: 4779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 10:40am
ARRGGHHH!
 
The world is going to end if we don't pass the stimulus NOW! (according to Obama)
 
 
"This recession might linger for years. Our economy will lose 5 million more jobs. Unemployment will approach double digits. Our nation will sink deeper into a crisis that, at some point, we may not be able to reverse," Obama wrote in the newspaper piece titled, "The Action Americans Need."
 
Way to "prop" up the economy bub. I'm sure my customers will jump out there and spend money with you saying stuff like this everyday in the papers.
 
Remind me how well the last "rushed" through bill went bailing out the banks...
 
Oh, yeah, we now need another...
 
Someone turn the lights off when the dems are done destroying our economy.
Back to Top
FreeEnterprise View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Not a card-carrying member of the DNC

Joined: 14 October 2008
Location: Trails Of Doom
Status: Offline
Points: 4779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 12:38pm
Whoops, the government overpaid for the bank stocks they bought...
 
I'm sure they will do better with our health care...
 
Back to Top
FreeEnterprise View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Not a card-carrying member of the DNC

Joined: 14 October 2008
Location: Trails Of Doom
Status: Offline
Points: 4779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 1:13pm
This guy is a WACKO...
 
 
Really, don't watch it...
 
I mean it, its stupid, crazy talk...
Back to Top
Bruce Banner View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 28 August 2008
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce Banner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 1:56pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Lets look at what caused this recession. In my opinion, the way Americans lived in debt and bought so much with money they didn't have caused the housing market to continue skyrocketing. But, that was a house of cards. There wasn't real money there. Just like the internet stocks a while back. When you start valuing things based on what you think the future holds... You are going to fail.
 
Yes and no.  Debt is a good thing.  Debt is the great multiplier.  Without debt, growth is severely limited.  Many things simply cannot be accomplished without debt.
 
The problem (IMO) is the separation of decision-making and risk.  Much like an owner-managed business tends to get run with greater care than businesses where management plays with other people's money, debt held by the issuer tends to be managed more carefully than debt not held by the issuer.
 
Securitization can also be a great thing, but there are inherent risks in the process that were not managed well with the mortgage-backed securities.  A lot of people at several steps in the process did not conduct sufficiently careful risk analysis, all the way from debt originators to final security purchasers.
 
And all things are valued based on what the future holds.  The value of any business is not the value of its inventory but the value of its orders and prospects, and need not be risky at all.  It is not difficult to think of major segments of the economy that operate almost entirely on future promises, and which are far safer than hard-asset industries.
 
Quote During the "good" times, the government forced banks to make bad loans, because as Bill Clinton stated, "Everyone deserves the American dream".
 
I agree that pushing home ownership hard was a mistake, and clearly a significant contributing factor to the current housing mess, which is clearly a significant contributing factor to the overall problem.  It goes far beyond that, though, and beyond securitization. 
 
When I purchased my current home the bank authorized me for a mortgage far in excess of what I wanted to take on, certainly did not require any down payment - and these were loans that were NOT securitized, but held by the bank.  Once housing prices started going up, people were all too happy to jump on the "greater fool" theory of finance.  Clearly a mistake, and a very broadbased one.
 
Quote  (look at the banking stocks). Propping them up will only drag out the end result.
 
While I am generally opposed to propping up failing companies, banks are special (along with a few other select industries).  There is a reason we have a national bank and not a national tire manufacturer.  Banks are the lifeblood of the economy.  When banks suffer, the whole economy suffers.  Part of the reason we have not had a major collapse since the 30s is specifically the tight controls on banks, as well as prior bank bailouts and backstops.  The same is true in other countries as well.
 
Banks are not just another business, and we would be foolish to think of them that way.
 
Quote Kind of like how the government bailed out GM. Everyone knows GM has had problems way before the economic turndown.
 
I have yet to hear a compelling reason why Chapter 11 is not the correct answer for Detroit.
 
Quote If government wants typical Americans to think they too are not about greed, (hard to ignore). They could stop with all the babysitting and let free markets do what they do.
 
A free market is an excellent wealth creation machine.  That, however, is also all that it is.  There are plenty of things that a free market cannot create.  Things that we like.
 
A free market will also necessarily have volatility, occasional crashes, issues of public policy, and so forth.  Some of these things we find socially unacceptable, so we try to put parameters around the market, and nudge it when it moves too extremely.
 
The free market is a powerful tool that we should harness.  It need not be an ideology.
 
Quote Look at the congresses approval ratings. And yet they just got a huge raise... Hmm. How many people get raises for doing a bad job?
 
You will be happy to know that the Obama administration and Congressional Democrats are trying to stop that.
 
Waste and excess are not conservative family values
Nature is not a liberal plot
A Good Energy Plan
Back to Top
Bruce Banner View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 28 August 2008
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce Banner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 2:15pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

 
Keynesian economics is not proven. It is theory. And bad theory at that.,,
 
Keynesian theory is certainly controversial, and was out of vogue in the US until fairly recently.  Whether it is a bad theory or not is perhaps a subjective matter.
 
 
Quote I can hear you now..."Oh, Free, you can't prove that..."
 
Wanna bet?
 
What is the interest rate right now?
 
0.
 
Did it fix anything?
 
No.
 
 
By "the interest rate" I presume you mean the Fed Funds rate?  Currently set at a range from 0-0.25 percent.
 
This has nothing to do with Keynesian theory, but is actually a free market tool used by the Federal Reserve Bank to control the flow of currency.  A rate this low is basically the government taking its hands off completely, to allow maximum currency flow.
 
It is basically deregulation of interbank funds flow.  So I would think you would support this.
 
And did it fix anything?  I don't know how you can say "no" - unless you expected some magical result.  It has resulted in lower interest rates charged to end users, which makes it easier to buy homes, and has reduced the sting of ARMs, which has held off at least some foreclosures.  It has also made business loans cheaper, which should encourage some more free market behavior.
 
Any Fed Funds rate greater than zero is basically restraint of currency, and is used to keep inflation under control.
 
Or you might be thinking of the discount rate, but that doesn't make much sense in this context.
 
Quote How much lower can they make it?
 
uh, they can't its done... unless we change math... Or devalue the currency... (oh, wait, that is exactly what they are doing)
 
Actually, they could make it less than zero, and they could do that with the discount rate as well.  I seem to recall that some other national banks did that once or twice before...  not sure.
 
And that would in fact be a subsidy of sorts, although not a Keynesian one.
 
Quote  
We are coming out of a war, where we spent more money than ever before.
 
$594,323,000,000.00 +
 
 
Exactly what that weak theory calls for... And yet, the recession is just getting worse.
 
 
But surely you cannot doubt that the war, at a minimum, has had some short-term Keynesian benefits?  Soldiers employed are citizens not unemployed.  People building warships are people holding jobs.
 
Your false dichotomy of  "it's worse now than before, therefore the war didn't help" is just that - false.  The correct question is whether our current situation would have been better or worse without the war, and that is a far more complicated question.
 
But even so, this war has been a very wasteful war, from a Keynesian perspective.  Big chunks of the money is literally given away to foreigners - that has no Keynesian effect.  Other big chunks are used to employ foreigners to build infrastructure in foreign countries - that has a great Keynesian effect - for Iraq and Afghanistan, but doesn't help us here.  Other chunks of money are used to buy equipment from factories abroad, again not helping our local situation.
 
This war is entirely different in that respect from WWII, where overwhelmingly the war money was spent putting Americans to work in American factories.
 
 
 
Quote
See, this is the problem with having a broken world view. Either nothing matters and you believe that everything just evolved. Or you believe in absolutes, that God Created the world, and we should do our best in everything we do, to the glory of Him.
 
Spending money you don't have and putting that burden on your future generations is not the way out of an economic mess.
 
Saving for the rainy day is. The Bible says to work and save.
 
Secular humanists, say survival of the fittest. So you better spend all you have and then some, so that your are in a "better" position than your neighbor...
 
You all have been sold a bill of goods that is wrong. And yet, you don't question it. You just follow along, figuring someday someone will figure it out and everything will be rosy...
 
 
This whole thing is just as silly now as before.  Frankly, you are a couple of decades behind schedules.  The whole godless communist fad died with McCarthy.  It was silly then, it is silly now.
Waste and excess are not conservative family values
Nature is not a liberal plot
A Good Energy Plan
Back to Top
Bruce Banner View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 28 August 2008
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce Banner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 2:17pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

 
Remind me how well the last "rushed" through bill went
 
Don't remind me.  The Patriot Act was an abomination.
 
While speed is important, I would rather get this bill right, both in terms of substance and bipartisanship.  I think it is important that we get something most Americans can feel hopeful about.  The last thing we need right now is half the country feeling like they had something jammed down their throats.
Waste and excess are not conservative family values
Nature is not a liberal plot
A Good Energy Plan
Back to Top
Bruce Banner View Drop Down
Gold Member
Gold Member
Avatar

Joined: 28 August 2008
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1128
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce Banner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 2:19pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

This guy is a WACKO...
 
 
Really, don't watch it...
 
I mean it, its stupid, crazy talk...
 
In fact it is stupid, crazy talk.  I can't stand pundits, and I really can't stand pundits who feel that yelling makes them sound smarter.
 
This clip is completely devoid of substance.  Just buzzwords tossed about in an inflammatory manner.  Useless.
Waste and excess are not conservative family values
Nature is not a liberal plot
A Good Energy Plan
Back to Top
FreeEnterprise View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Not a card-carrying member of the DNC

Joined: 14 October 2008
Location: Trails Of Doom
Status: Offline
Points: 4779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 3:36pm
I tried to warn you...
Back to Top
agentwhale007 View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Forum's Vladimir Lenin

Joined: 20 June 2002
Location: GNV FLA
Status: Offline
Points: 11696
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote agentwhale007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 5:26pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Saving for the rainy day is. The Bible says to work and save.
 
Secular humanists, say survival of the fittest. So you better spend all you have and then some, so that your are in a "better" position than your neighbor...
 
You all have been sold a bill of goods that is wrong. And yet, you don't question it. You just follow along, figuring someday someone will figure it out and everything will be rosy...
 


This attitude is why the Republican party had a net loss in the past election.


"So when Romney wins in a landslide, what will the liberal media do?"
This Ma**edited**hine Kills **edited**as**edited**ists.




Back to Top
__sneaky__ View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Voted 2010 Most Improved Forumer

Joined: 14 January 2006
Location: Uncertain
Status: Offline
Points: 5285
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote __sneaky__ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 6:28pm
Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Saving for the rainy day is. The Bible says to work and save.
 
This is true.
 
Secular humanists, say survival of the fittest. So you better spend all you have and then some, so that your are in a "better" position than your neighbor...
 
However most people today are retarded, survival of the fittest never at any point, in any way, in any shape, or any form, AT ALL, ever said spending all your money is smart. Way to go again with your twisting established theories to suit your needs tho! You sure are good at it.
 
You all have been sold a bill of goods that is wrong. And yet, you don't question it. You just follow along, figuring someday someone will figure it out and everything will be rosy...
 
You really are a tool.
 
Now FE, as much as I don't like you. You did say something I completly agree with.
 
"Everyone deserves the american dream" is true. However no one, and I mean NO ONE deserves to have it handed to them. If you don't work, you don't eat. If you cant afford a pretty house and to buy your own fricken converter box for your stupid t.v. and crap such as this, you should have gone to college. If you work hard and make your own money, I respect you. If you sit at home (if you are capable of working, I dont think this is true of the truly dissabled at all.) and do nothing, then dont eat, and starve. It's your own stubborn stupid fault.
 
The government is too big, I agree. It screws most everything up. I tend to mostly blame the senate.
 
But you also said something very stupid. Obama never said the government was going to fix everything. Hell, in his innaguration(sp?) he said specifically "The government cannot do this alone" and then went on to how it needed the help of its citizens. Yeah, we have done some stupid things, but did Obama start this crisis? No. Did Obama really do anything yet that has harmed us that no one knew he had planned? No, in fact he is the only president we have had in a looooooooong time who is actually doing what he promised.
 
FE, its a strange concept for you, but please... Just shut up and see whats in store. You whining does no good except raise our blood pressure and make you sound foolish.
 
"Better to say nothing and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt." -Abraham Lincoln
Back to Top
Benjichang View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
I pwned Leroy Jenkins!

Joined: 03 January 2004
Location: R'lyeh
Status: Offline
Points: 12518
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Benjichang Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 February 2009 at 7:36pm
Quadruple poast. DAMMMN.
Back to Top
FreeEnterprise View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Not a card-carrying member of the DNC

Joined: 14 October 2008
Location: Trails Of Doom
Status: Offline
Points: 4779
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FreeEnterprise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 February 2009 at 8:20am

Originally posted by __sneaky__ __sneaky__ wrote:

Originally posted by FreeEnterprise FreeEnterprise wrote:

Saving for the rainy day is. The Bible says to work and save.

 

This is true.

 

 

Now FE, as much as I don't like you. You did say something I completly agree with.

 

"Everyone deserves the american dream" is true. However no one, and I mean NO ONE deserves to have it handed to them. If you don't work, you don't eat. If you cant afford a pretty house and to buy your own fricken converter box for your stupid t.v. and crap such as this, you should have gone to college. If you work hard and make your own money, I respect you. If you sit at home (if you are capable of working, I dont think this is true of the truly dissabled at all.) and do nothing, then dont eat, and starve. It's your own stubborn stupid fault.

 

The government is too big, I agree. It screws most everything up. I tend to mostly blame the senate.

 

But you also said something very stupid. Obama never said the government was going to fix everything. Hell, in his innaguration(sp?) he said specifically "The government cannot do this alone" and then went on to how it needed the help of its citizens. Yeah, we have done some stupid things, but did Obama start this crisis? No. Did Obama really do anything yet that has harmed us that no one knew he had planned? No, in fact he is the only president we have had in a looooooooong time who is actually doing what he promised.

 

FE, its a strange concept for you, but please... Just shut up and see whats in store. You whining does no good except raise our blood pressure and make you sound foolish.

 

"Better to say nothing and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt." -Abraham Lincoln

 

“Obama never said the government was going to fix everything”.

 

Here is the direct quote from Obama, January 8h 2009

 

“only government can provide the short-term boost necessary to lift us from a recession this deep and severe.  Only government can break the vicious cycles that are crippling our economy”

 

you can even watch it on video on this link..

 

http://change.gov/newsroom/entry/dramatic_action/

 

Look, I want Obama to succeed, he is my President too. But, the problem with so many democrats (in office) not paying taxes, (no wonder they don’t worry about raising them, since they don’t pay them).  His vetting process is Horrific. We all know what would have happened if this were a republican. And that is why your “blood pressure” is rising.

 

We have two different standards in this country. You can’t have it both ways, either we are against corruption, (take away pelosi’s jet then, and get rid of geithner) Or corruption is OK.

 

Look, in school you are indoctrinated that there are no moral absolutes, whats wrong for one person is OK for another. Unless someone is a Christian, then lash out as often as you can, as they are so wrong…

 

I prove myself right over and over on this board, and yet, many of the mods, and almost every person on here attacks me by calling me names and gloss over all the facts I post. Many of you are the future of our country. And yet you want to blame everything on someone else. WE elected these people and we now are going to have to pay. Pelosi thinks that 500,000,000 Americans are going to lose their jobs if we don’t pass the stimulus bill (spending bill) right away.

 

There are only 300,000,000 Americans…

 

The media ignores this type of “logic” coming from the left… If a republican had said it, it would be the headline of every news program in the country. That is a fact. Potato, patato, remember.

 

No wonder the libs don’t have a problem spending $1,000,000,000,000.00 They don’t have a clue how much that is. So thats around $5,000.00 from each worker in America, that they want to spend, on THIS bill, and there are more coming, not including the "bank bailout, which they overpaid by $78,000,000,000.00 Yes, that is BILLIONs overpaid, good thing we rushed.

 
So much for “bipartisanship” we were promised. Obama made it clear when he called a press conference to announce he was “meeting” with republicans… Just so he could tell them “he won”, so they need to shut up and hurry up and pass the bill. Since you guys don’t pay attention, I’m sure you missed Pelosi’s other astounding remark. Let me quote it for you.

 

“I didn’t come here to be partisan. I didn’t come here to be bipartisan. I came here, as did my colleagues, to be nonpartisan, to work for the American people, to do what is in their interest.”

 

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/01/29/partisan-barbs-follow-house-stimulus-vote/

 

Fact is, she didn’t “let” any republican have ANY input on the “spending” bill. How is that good for America?

 

It has gotten out of hand. You and your kids will pay for this mess now.

 

Obama got elected based on Change and Hope. The only thing we have gotten so far from this election is nominates that don’t pay their taxes. More government funded abortions, a massive porkulus bill that will devastate small business (the true backbone of our economy) and more corruption. Oh, and we gave terrorists Miranda rights…

 

Not the change we need.

 
You know, this sure looks like "on the job training" to me...


Edited by FreeEnterprise - 06 February 2009 at 8:27am
They tremble at my name...
Back to Top
Bunkered View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
What AM I smoking?

Joined: 10 June 2002
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 5690
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bunkered Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 February 2009 at 10:53am
I'm wondering how it is that you blame the Democrats for anything related to the bank bailout...
Fairly certain that was Dubya.

Regardless, I find your ability to twist and mis-represent "facts" quite astounding.
You're pissed because you think Obama will be bad for small business (and therefore your bottom line, as a business owner); we'll see whether that's true or not.

I haven't seen you "prove yourself right" one time...
What I've seen is you regurgitate information that you heard somewhere but didn't fully understand.
Your comment about "buying fossil fuel vehicles" and how that is counter to that whole "green" government scenario proved that magnificently.

All I have to say about the billions (hopefully) being spent by the Dems is that it will be to help people here in the US rather than someplace I'll never see or visit.
Back to Top
StormyKnight View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: 28 July 2003
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2980
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote StormyKnight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 February 2009 at 12:35pm
"You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot lift the wage earner up by pulling the wage payer down.
You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred.
You cannot build character and courage by taking away people's initiative and independence.
You cannot help people permanently by doing for them, what they could and should do for themselves." 
      
Back to Top
adrenalinejunky View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member

strike 1 11/24/08 language

Joined: 10 June 2002
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4771
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote adrenalinejunky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 February 2009 at 12:39pm
Originally posted by Bunkered Bunkered wrote:

I'm wondering how it is that you blame the Democrats for anything related to the bank bailout...
Fairly certain that was Dubya.


i'm fairly certain that bush didnt have the authority to make that a law all by himself.

i'm also quite certain that trying to pin blame on either party is absurd as it was a largely bipartisan movement.


Edited by adrenalinejunky - 06 February 2009 at 12:39pm
Back to Top
mod98commando View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar

Joined: 10 June 2002
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4423
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mod98commando Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 February 2009 at 6:05pm
Originally posted by StormyKnight StormyKnight wrote:

"You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot lift the wage earner up by pulling the wage payer down.
You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred.
You cannot build character and courage by taking away people's initiative and independence.
You cannot help people permanently by doing for them, what they could and should do for themselves." 
      


Unfortunately, it seems that nobody believes these things anymore. People may say they do because it sounds nice but their actions often say otherwise.
oreomann33: Everybody invades Poland
Rofl_Mao: And everyone eats turkey
Me: But only if they're hungary
Mack: Yeah but hungary people go russian through their food and end up with greece on everyth
Back to Top
__sneaky__ View Drop Down
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Avatar
Voted 2010 Most Improved Forumer

Joined: 14 January 2006
Location: Uncertain
Status: Offline
Points: 5285
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote __sneaky__ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 February 2009 at 6:49pm
You prove yourself right over and over?
 
Please name once?
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 4567>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 10.03

This page was generated in 0.250 seconds.