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Please help w/ A5 low fps, auto-ing, etc |
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mubikS
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Topic: Please help w/ A5 low fps, auto-ing, etcPosted: 05 January 2008 at 9:33pm |
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Two requests: First, I'll give you what happened today and maybe you've got an idea of what's wrong. Second, I'm trying to understand how the marker functions. Please tell me if i'm right / what I'm not getting. I picked up a used A5 two weeks ago and put a few bags of paint through it testing it out. It worked fine. I got to the field this morning, took off the rear plate/sling swivel and put a drop or two of (paintball) oil on the rear bolt. I also put a drop or two of oil in the ASA and fired it to move it through the gun. I took the gun to chrono and immediately started having problems: I could not get the gun to shoot much more than 200fps. Turned the velocity screw out so far that the gun would just stutter, but never got above 215fps. Turn it in, and it would go down to 170fps. Here's the big problem: If I got any sort of good high rate of fire going (esp with the E-grip) the gun would go to full-auto on it's own and would continue until I shut off the air with the remote. I disassembled it at the end of the day and found that the rear bolt o-ring was stiff and worn-out. Hopefully this was the issue.
So maybe if I understand how the gun operates I can troubleshoot it.Tell me if this is right? 1.The trigger trips the sear, which releases the rear bolt. 2. The rear spring pushes the rear bolt into the valve, striking the valve plunger. The front bolt, linked to the rear bolt, has moved forward and moved the ball off the detent. 3. The valve opens, allows air down the side channels, around the tombstone, and into the front of the power tube, firing the ball. But what makes the action cycle back, i.e. what forces the rear bolt back to catch on the sear? Does air escape around the valve plunger when it is depressed to force the bolt back? |
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Tippman A5, WAS E-grip, double trigger
14" Smart Parts Teardrop, Flatline Tasco RedDot, Lapco offset rail 3-pt CAR stock 45/45 System-X, Pure Energy remote |
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Snake6
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Posted: 05 January 2008 at 9:41pm |
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The Marker is operated by blowback. Therefore the excess gas used by the marker after firing is redirected back around the valve which pushes on the hammer causing it to recoil.
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mubikS
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Joined: 29 December 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9 |
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Posted: 05 January 2008 at 10:11pm |
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Gotcha. Clarification: Edges on the sear in the mech grip and in the e-grip are sharp and fresh, as is the edge on the rear bolt/hammer. I believe I have some sort of low pressure: not enough blowback to push the rear bold back to reset the sear, therefore the gun just full-autos. Which o-rings would affect this? The valve-to-tombstone o-ring? The rear valve o-ring? The rear bolt o-ring? All or any of the above? |
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Tippman A5, WAS E-grip, double trigger
14" Smart Parts Teardrop, Flatline Tasco RedDot, Lapco offset rail 3-pt CAR stock 45/45 System-X, Pure Energy remote |
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tallen702
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Posted: 05 January 2008 at 11:14pm |
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I saw you said you were using a remote line. Try this. Take the tank off of the remote and try it on the marker. If the problem is fixed, it's the remote. To solve the remote issue, when you crank the remote's on/off to the on position, turn it on all the way, then back it off about 1/4-1/2 turn. I'm guessing the actuating pin from the remote line is interrupting the air flow. It's a common issue.
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<Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.>
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Mack
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Has no impulse! control Joined: 13 January 2004 Location: 2nd Circle Status: Offline Points: 9696 |
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 3:06am |
If this is the issue, it can be solved by installing a few metal washers around the threads of the on/off knob. (They prevent the pin from going in as far.) |
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mubikS
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 10:42am |
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The fellas on A50G.net are saying the same thing. Turning the remote knob all the way in would definately be a noob mistake I'd make. Just went and tried it out. As soon as I get a high rate of fire going, it goes runaway and full-autos. I'm not real keen on taking off the remote and mounting the tank right to the ASA, as I don't want to lose a whole bottle of C02, then not be able to work on this anymore. |
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Tippman A5, WAS E-grip, double trigger
14" Smart Parts Teardrop, Flatline Tasco RedDot, Lapco offset rail 3-pt CAR stock 45/45 System-X, Pure Energy remote |
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tallen702
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 11:06am |
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How would you lose a whole bottle of CO2? by directly mounting it?
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<Removed overly wide sig. Tsk, you know better.>
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carl_the_sniper
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 2:35pm |
Seriously. |
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Lost Kaim
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 6:14pm |
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I don't understand why the gun would keep full-autoing when there isn't enough air. It should eventually just stop because less and less Co2 is being blown back (resulting in the gun failing to cock) and eventually the bolt is not pushed back far enough to gain the momentum to activate the valve plunger. |
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Tippmann A-5
14" Lapco Bigshot Opsgear G36 Stock 32 Degrees Coiled Remote with Slide Check JT 3-point Tactical Sling Co2 Tank - 20oz GXG Tactical Vest VForce Profiler |
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Ilford Rule
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 6:30pm |
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There is enough air. What he means is that there's not enough pressure coming through, but there is enough pressure in the tank. Odds are the remote is interrupting gas flow.
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CPro (w/ polished internals)
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mubikS
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 6:38pm |
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When it goes full-auto, it will cycle no less than 200 times before stopping... I only know this because it burned through a full hopper of paint twice. This morning, I went ahead and mounted the tank directly on the bottom line and gave it a shot. Same story... full auto until I unscrewed the bottle. |
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Tippman A5, WAS E-grip, double trigger
14" Smart Parts Teardrop, Flatline Tasco RedDot, Lapco offset rail 3-pt CAR stock 45/45 System-X, Pure Energy remote |
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Ilford Rule
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 6:43pm |
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Hmm. Have you tried only your bottle? If the pin valve/regulator on your bottle/tank (your post said CO2, but your sig says HPA. Which have you been using?) is damaged, it's possible that this could happen. Have you tried a new sear spring?
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CPro (w/ polished internals)
14" Bigshot BT SBS Various Rails NcSTAR D4B Macro AA 68/45
CCI Phantom 45 Grips |
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mubikS
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 7:18pm |
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Rule, I have tried the HPA tank, the Co2 tank, with remote or without, with bottomline or without, with e-grip or mech grip, which each have their own trigger group and sear.
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Tippman A5, WAS E-grip, double trigger
14" Smart Parts Teardrop, Flatline Tasco RedDot, Lapco offset rail 3-pt CAR stock 45/45 System-X, Pure Energy remote |
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Ilford Rule
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 7:24pm |
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Hmm. In that case this is getting strange. I'm gonna start grasping at straws, and just throw out some ideas as they come to my head. So some won't make sense probably:
-Cracked powertube. -Backwards detent. -Try a new drive spring. -Rounded notch in the hammer. When you say without bottomline, you mean you attached the tank directly to the tombstone right? I assume thats what you meant, but if its not try that. |
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CPro (w/ polished internals)
14" Bigshot BT SBS Various Rails NcSTAR D4B Macro AA 68/45
CCI Phantom 45 Grips |
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mubikS
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Posted: 06 January 2008 at 10:41pm |
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I'm grasping at straws too. Now I'm not sure my e-grip trigger group is assembled correctly. I took it apart, and found that it has the slider installed (part 98-18), as well as an oval-pivot-hole sear (part 02-35) instead of the sear shown in the e-grip diagram (part TA01135). So I took out the slider and put in the e-grip sear, as shown in the e-grip diagram. Before I did this, I could use my marker with the e-grip turned off... it just worked like a normal mech grip. Now the trigger will not trip the sear unless the e-grip is on. This seems like a serious un-improvement... as my battery could go dead in the middle of a game and I'd be screwed. Um, whiskey tango?? |
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Tippman A5, WAS E-grip, double trigger
14" Smart Parts Teardrop, Flatline Tasco RedDot, Lapco offset rail 3-pt CAR stock 45/45 System-X, Pure Energy remote |
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Papiriqui629
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Posted: 08 January 2008 at 2:22pm |
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The only thing i could think is, go to a store and buy a new sear for the trigger, sometimes the trigger sear wears off and does not hold the rear piston, also if is not the sear check the piston where the sear is supposed to hold it and see if its a little rounded because that could be it. Same thing happened to me but with a response trigger so im guessing it could be the same. In my case it was the sear. |
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Papiriqui629
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Posted: 08 January 2008 at 2:24pm |
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Also i forgot to mention i dont know if you fixed the FPS problem. I kind of had a little problem like that but mine would come down from 380 fps and it was just the rear cap with the swivel that was bad. I replaced it and got the marker to the velocity i wanted and now i could either take up or down.
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Ilford Rule
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Posted: 09 January 2008 at 4:01pm |
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Use the e-grip sear. One downfall of electronic markers is exactly what you have said. Carry an extra battery.
Let us know if that works. |
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CPro (w/ polished internals)
14" Bigshot BT SBS Various Rails NcSTAR D4B Macro AA 68/45
CCI Phantom 45 Grips |
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