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BATF on Silencers

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Bruce A. Frank View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce A. Frank Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 April 2006 at 3:21pm
Originally posted by daveb333 daveb333 wrote:

Ok, this is my final post cause no one has listened to me yet.

 

A paintball gun uses COMPRESSED AIR (or nitrogen)!
A firearm uses EXPLOSIONS

The BATF sets the laws on ALCOHOL, TOBACCO AND FIREARMS

So yes, they do care that a paintball gun isn't a firearm, the only person who doesn't is you.

 

bruce a... have you been listening????  I said it is projected BY COMBUSTION not a combustable product you dummas!  STAY ON TOPIC!

BATF regulates silencers on FIREARMS... end of story!  Paintball guns are not firearms, therefor the BATF does not make laws about paintball guns!  Maybe you dont understand this buy BATF makes laws about silencers on firearms!  They dont make it on cars, or motorcycles, or boats, or EVEN PAINTBALLGUNS!  It is strictly FIREARMS.  Which is why its called BATF and not BATFPM (Beuro of alchol tobacco firearms and paintball markers)

How bout you guys read and understand everything before you post.

Dave,

No one is listening to you because you haven't the slightest idea about which you speak. You do not know what the BATF charter covers, but that isn't even the point. As I have said about 14 times so far BATF regulates the piece of equipment called a silencer. It makes no difference whether the silencer is installed on, I'll say it again, a "firearm", a paintball marker or a BB gun. That is the fact. Your convoluted logic about method of projectile propulsion has nothing to do with the silencer itself.

Because the name of the the department, Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, does not include the word "and Silencers" (on paintball markers) does not mean they don't regulate them. The silencer is treated exactly the same way that a trigger mechanism designed to convert a semi-auto gun to full auto is treated. It is illegal to own that part, even if you don't own the gun into which it fits. If you own that conversion part you are subject to arrest...the part alone.

If you own or manufacture the silencer, you are subject to arrest even it you do not own a firearm, a paintball marker or a BB gun on which to install it.
=======================
Now, to progress on to your definition of "firearm."  If the definition were as limited as you delude yourself in to believing there would still be a hole in your logic through which one could drive a truck. A bullet is propelled by the products of combustion, not explosion, of fuel burning. It makes no difference if the fuel is propane gas or gun powder. The expanding gas drives the projectile out of the barrel. But this has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with the legality or illegality of silencers.

Gosh, golly, is that redundant enough?



Edited by Bruce A. Frank - 08 April 2006 at 8:06pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RavenGuard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 April 2006 at 4:10pm
I'd just like to make it clear that what happens when a paintball gun cycles is considered an explosion in proper use of the english language. I am sending you a pm daveb333, because you deserve to know what an idiot you are after standing up for the wrong information.  Have  more respect for your fellow paintballers. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chuck357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 April 2006 at 6:59pm
Don' take this the wrong way you guys, I 100% agree with all the info, but Dave is ignorant and just needs some guidance, take it easy on him.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pirate1650 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 April 2006 at 7:35pm
Originally posted by daveb333 daveb333 wrote:

The law really only applies to the airsoft guns with more universal sizes such as .45 caliber which matches quite a few guns such as the standerd rifle for the us military - M4 and M16A1 the previous standard rifle for the us military.

 

Ive done my research, but have you truly done yours?

This includes the research in your brain required to understand information that is given to you.

I don't know anything about silencers but I do know something about guns and just wanted to clear some things up so you don't get misinformed.

1.Gunpowder actually burns, not explode, very quickly and its the rapidly expanding gasses pushing the bullet out.  The only exeption to this that I know of is blank cartriges, blanks are loaded with an explosive powder.

2.The military rifles you mentioned as an example of .45 caliber weapons are not .45 and are anything from 5.56, .223, or 7.62 x 39 depending on where you are in the evolution of the current military rifle

3.The last thing here, which im fairly sure of, that the M-4 is the carbine version of the M-16, and both are currently being used by our military.  I belive I head that the Marines still use the M-16 and the Army has mostly switched over to the M-4.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce A. Frank Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 April 2006 at 7:54pm

Originally posted by Chuck357 Chuck357 wrote:

Don' take this the wrong way you guys, I 100% agree with all the info, but Dave is ignorant and just needs some guidance, take it easy on him.

Well, for my part, I keep repeating the same info to him over and over again. And he comes back SCREAMING AT US that we are a bunch of imbeciles (in effect) because we don't accept his wild claims. Quoting chapter and verse from BATF regs and BATF's previous answers to this specific question seems to have had no impact...except to make him more angry. Therefore I can understand some here on the forum getting a little pointed with their criticism of him.

It is also clear that he has not read the proper edicate on the forums posts.

Welcome to the Tippmann Forum! Read This!



Edited by Bruce A. Frank - 08 April 2006 at 8:04pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote You Wont See Me Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 April 2006 at 8:28pm
Dave, prove the BATF doesnt care by videotapeing yourself using a paintball silencer and sending them a copy of it. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chuck357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 April 2006 at 12:18pm

I know, I know I just went through it with him about paintballs,he claimed to the death that all paint was manufactured exactly the same size and could be shot from every marker manufactured,he had me more than a little tiff,but most of us aren't about ragging someone.As I said he needs to be proved wrong and educated,then he will a good player.

 

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Edited by Chuck357 - 09 April 2006 at 12:19pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nauzerlvr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 April 2006 at 3:37pm
Jeez....let it go!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote daveb333 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 April 2006 at 11:13pm
Ok, DROP IT.  I didnt realize that some paintballs have a difference of .005 caliber, but you can still fire any paintball out of any paintball gun.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chuck357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2006 at 8:02am
It isn't .005 caliber , it's .005 of an inch difference, and .005 is a lot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce A. Frank Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2006 at 9:47am

Originally posted by Chuck357 Chuck357 wrote:

It isn't .005 caliber , it's .005 of an inch difference, and .005 is a lot.

Actually it is closer to .010".  And, caliber is inch...fifty caliber is .50"...Thirty caliber is .30"...Forty five caliber is .45".

There are variations in measurement and caliber, such as the fact that 68 caliber varies from .678" to .693" or that 38 caliber actually measures .357" and 30 caliber can be .308" to .312".



Edited by Bruce A. Frank - 10 April 2006 at 12:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote daveb333 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2006 at 1:33pm
lmao, taking any argument you guys can get huh?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hybrid-sniper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2006 at 1:35pm

Originally posted by daveb333 daveb333 wrote:

lmao, taking any argument you guys can get huh?

And in the process making you sound like a pompous idiot, so yeah. It's worth it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chuck357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2006 at 5:02pm
LOL...Dave you shouldn't be so argumentive or so adament you're always correct
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RicWhic414 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2006 at 5:52pm
its ok guys take it easy on dave hes been wrong on ever post that i have ever read of his... so we just need to explain to him sometimes more then once that he is wrong and just tell him the right answer... silencers are illegal just for the simple fact that they can or could be but on a real firearm and what would be the reason for someone to have a silencer other then killin someone or somethin without bein noticed... so for that silencers r illegal and thats it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote STANGER Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2006 at 5:54pm
Well this did not turn out like I thought it would. Sorry for causing any problems. I just wanted to get it out what the ATF had on the website. So just to see what a real ATF agent would say if he/she caught someone with one on thier paintball gun I asked a gentleman who I know is an ATF agent and well Dave I would not have on your gun if I was you. He said he did not care what you had it on. If it did anything to "Silence" the "marker" then an arrest was would be issued. He gave the example that someone talked about earlier on the 2 liter bottles. You can take a two liter bottle and tape it to the end of a gun and it will "silence" it. Now having an empty two liter bottle is nothing to the ATF, taped to the end of a gun, Felony. It as he said does not get any simpler than that. I even asked about the def. of gun, or firearm and all he would say is if it can silence a "Paintball marker" it could easliy silence a real weapon with very little adaption and the idea of its use is all they need to get you. I can understand your frustration, I just do not want to see anyone get into any kind of trouble over something like this, so please be careful in whatever any of you choose to do. I just wanted to let everyone know what I have found out about it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote daveb333 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2006 at 10:23pm

Originally posted by RicWhic414 RicWhic414 wrote:

its ok guys take it easy on dave hes been wrong on ever post that i have ever read of his... so we just need to explain to him sometimes more then once that he is wrong and just tell him the right answer... silencers are illegal just for the simple fact that they can or could be but on a real firearm and what would be the reason for someone to have a silencer other then killin someone or somethin without bein noticed... so for that silencers r illegal and thats it.

Lol, I have been wrong in one thing.. that is saying that paintballs are the same size.  Ill agree to that.  But I havn't been wrong in any other post.  I have disagreed with you in every single post, doesnt mean im wrong.  Silencers are legal, just read the post how i spell out the law about silencers on paintball guns.  Its quite simple... but you still dont get it.  Email the BATF and see for yourself, thats what i did.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce A. Frank Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2006 at 11:34pm
Originally posted by daveb333 daveb333 wrote:

Originally posted by RicWhic414 RicWhic414 wrote:

its ok guys take it easy on dave hes been wrong on ever post that i have ever read of his... so we just need to explain to him sometimes more then once that he is wrong and just tell him the right answer... silencers are illegal just for the simple fact that they can or could be but on a real firearm and what would be the reason for someone to have a silencer other then killin someone or somethin without bein noticed... so for that silencers r illegal and thats it.

Lol, I have been wrong in one thing.. that is saying that paintballs are the same size.  Ill agree to that.  But I havn't been wrong in any other post.  I have disagreed with you in every single post, doesnt mean im wrong.  Silencers are legal, just read the post how i spell out the law about silencers on paintball guns.  Its quite simple... but you still dont get it.  Email the BATF and see for yourself, thats what i did.

Sure you did! Post the email reply.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote -=Kasutik=- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 April 2006 at 3:44am
if you want a "legal" silencer on your marker in USA, weld your barrel to your gun and weld your silencer to the barrel... it can therefore never be used on a fire arm.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RicWhic414 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 April 2006 at 7:26am

Originally posted by -=Kasutik=- -=Kasutik=- wrote:

if you want a "legal" silencer on your marker in USA, weld your barrel to your gun and weld your silencer to the barrel... it can therefore never be used on a fire arm.

im not sure if that is legal either cuz technically u can cut the welds off and still use it on another gun... and im not emaillin them because i already no the law silencer= illegal the only ones u can have are the fake silencers or suppressors but those dont do anythin

EDIT: u no what "daveb333" u go right ahead and get a silencer they prolly wont ever find out that u have one but if they do have fun with the fine or even jail time



Edited by RicWhic414 - 11 April 2006 at 7:30am
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