Woodsball/Scenario Players Post

NO

I can't possibly argue that there are people who try to play the role and call themselves snipers. However, no matter the setting, the standard military definitions can't apply to paintball.

For thoese of you saying it's just moving for a better angle without being seen and shooting, I have no clue how that can be considered sniping. It's exactly what everybody else does. I think we can all agree that people who try to sniper are attempting to do something different, wether it be working away from the team, hiding in ambush, scouting or attempting long range lob-shots. Saying that anyone who shoots from hiding is a sniper is a cop-out, since that isn't what people who call themselves snipers mean anyways.

The military style 2 person sniper team idea isn't particularly effective. In a military style sniper team you'd have a sniper and a spotter. The spotter is equipped with a standard type weapon with more firepower just in case, and a spotting scope of some type and is tasked with identifying targets and figuring ballistic data for the sniper to take the shot. The sniper has a percision rifle equipped with an optical sight that has an effective range that is farther than a standard issue weapon.

Now apply that to paintball. Say you have a "spotter" with a smaller high speed marker, like an A-5 RT and a "sniper" equipped with an accurate pump or semi, possibly with a sight or even a flatline for a bit more range. Now what exactly does the spotter do? He's not using a spotting scope or binoculars to pick targets for the sniper, since if he can hit them they're well within visual range. He's not making a wind call or figuring modified elevation adjustments for shooting uphill or down. So he's pretty much sitting there providing extra eyes for the sniper and firerpower for WHEN he gets in trouble. The "sniper" is waiting for a good shot, hopefully at a squad leader or somebody worth points in a scenario game, or somebody who would have some sort of effect in a firefight, like someone with a god gun or some such thing. He takes the shot and then what? He's just fired a low velocity, probably brightly colored projectile from inside of 50 yards. Somebody's going to see where that ball came from, or hear it. Also, they can see how it splattered and figure out where to start looking from there. Next they scan for likely hiding spots in that direction inside paintball range, or look for funny bushes with boots and barrels. If the sniper can hit them, even if he has a flatline or really accurate setup, they can hit him, even if it takes a few more balls. The spot him and light him up, or pound likely spots with paint until he tries to escape and is shot, fires back and is spotted, or gets hit.

Doesn't sound like they did a heck of a lot of good, even if they did take somebody out. Seems like if they had just both opened up with guns with a high rate of fire, and started by focusing on important targets, they could have made more eliminations, before they were themselves eliminated. Sounds like they'd also have been able to do more damage if they'd had more people for a functional ambush.

Now seriously, what kind of military sniper takes a shot inside of 50 yards? Snipers avoid engagements inside of 200 yards if they can since thats about where the human eye can detect someone who is camoflauged. Shooting from that distance would be suicidal. Snipers fire at longer ranges to avoid visual detection and to be able to get a way unseen, before the enemy can get close enough to see them and blast them all to crap. A paintball "sniper" just doesn't have the range.

I've played in my share of small woods games of 3-20 people, and scenario games ranging from 25-800 players. Never once have I seen anybody effectivly use sniper tactics. I've seen plenty try, and even occasionally hit someone, but never make any kind of differance to the outcome of a firefight, much less an attack. The only thing the "sniper" crowd has going for them is scaring new players into inaction because they think snipers can be effective.

I once led a group of mainly new players off to clear off a trail leading to an important base in a scenario game. We took some fire from the woods and they all froze up and were afraid to move foreward, afraid some magical invisable sniper would plink them with a single shot from a hidden place and from too far away for them to shoot back. Having a decent clue of how far the balls were coming from, I stepped full out into the middle of the trail trying to bait the "sniper" into shooting. He made an effort, I stood there, dodging balls and telling the newbs where he was. He was fireing with a flatline from long range, I actually managed to catch a ball and bring it back, showed it to the newbs to ease their fears. I found a few who weren't terrified, had them provide cover and quickly eliminated the "sniper" through fire and manuver. The same group of newbs during the course of the rest of the day took about 30 seconds to eliminate other "snipers". It never effected any mission, and definatly not the outcome of the game. Just one of many antecdotes I can pull up where sniping didn't do jack.

If anybody out there can give me a descrition of what a paintball sniper does that is signifigantly different from the average woodsball player, AND effective. I'm willing to debate it.

I know Im going to tick off alot on this but heres my view. Are there snipers in paintball? Yes. but not in the Long distance military sense. For one thing, Snipers are not found in Speedball. Too small for that.

So whats a guy to do? Well lets put it this way, In spec ops paintball deffinition, the hard charging Ambush guy is the Dagger, but hes ment to be the one that deals the final blow by flanking, which means hes probably gona be the vissible guy. His job is to Either deal the final blow or cause the last few into a panic and distract them long enough for the rest of the squad or team to finish the other team or squad.

The Sniper, sometimes called the ghost flanker or Ambush sniper however is the stealth factor, hes used for one of several things, the 1st is a defensive way, for this it may help if the player brings some Mines that can be activated by a wire or remote, Why do this? because once the other team realizes theres paintball mines there. they slow down, perfect for when a Strong side offense is used and when the sniper is covering the weakside. The more the sniper and any defense at base hold up the attackers, the better for offense team to get the flag or Objective. The second part of this defense is the sniper himself. If he keeps it to 1 to 2 shots and at a rang and spot he know he can hit the opponet, the better. With this and some skills and patiance and moving only when needed. This slows down the other team, because now they start shooting and wasting ammo on every bush, tree, bunker or fallen log around them in hopes of finding the guy. this is more along the lines of an Ambush sniper also, He goes about mid field, lays a mini ambush then retreats and sets up another mini ambush and keeps falling back, His main object is slowing the enemy down but eliminations are an extra, If he can pull them into range of the defense at the base area, thats when the enemy will be in trouble, becase by now they are probably low on ammo or forgot to reload and mostlikely are in the open. by the time they relize their mistake, they got to worry about 3-5 guys maybe in small games behind a good defense area probbaly in a 2 floor building and to top it off Probbaly got a good view from above and will force the enemy to huddle right next to bunker their at. enough time for the sniper to circle around and take them by surprise again either elimenating them or distracting them from the defense players.

The other form is the ghost flanker, the offense version of the sniper, He stays wide from the team and when the team gets into a fire fight, mostlikely a 50 50 fight where theres no clear advantage and it boils down to both sides tradding paint, this guy flanks them wide and by surprise, Once again Diverted attention, mostlikely going to lose a few in the initial ambush, and will be in a panic possibly.

Remember range is not a factor, Its more along the lines of stealth and quit ness, you don't need a 18 inch barrel unlees your using an AGD Tac one with Long bowkit just to prevent the rounds from smacking into the spring fed magizine

but I know alot will ignore me on this and will just call me crazy...

I said "spec ops paintball definitions" didn't I?
Ironically enough, last I checked in there was about 2weeks ago (last time I even visited here for actually posting was about 3+ months ago... at least)

Yea but Why beat around the bush? Granted as agrred, Due to velocity limits, the traditional thinking of sniper is gone. It is not possible to do that, no matter how much elevation, how well you match the paint to barrel, everything, Theres no way you can Shoot really far. That is why a paintball sniper role is more for mid range ambushes and wide stealth flanks.

NO, even if you tried there are to many branches that you would hit.

jw1961 wrote: <FONT size=7>NO, even if you tried there are to many branches that you would hit.

Soft cover may be a problem While one can eventually shot through it (after either unloading a large volume [ for bushes just to get one through] or just shooting till the impedding foliage is gone) youll have given away your position, thats why its said that when playing ambush sniper roles do not take that shot unless you are 100% sure its going to hit the guy and break on him, you want him and his buddys in a panic so you have some more seconds for the ambush before you need to move away and set up another ambush.

haha flatlines arent that accurate, but i know what you mean, those are some good points. Again i think people are still using the word sniper in paintball too literly, and that in an attempt to say their is no such thing they have to turn to the military definition and relate it to paintball.

Its just the title to a playing style, jeez

90% of woodsballers, even the ones who work as a team, attack the enemy with fast moving flanking movements and in large firefights. Most people dont have the patience to set up repeated small stage ambushes and wait for the perfect shot. I think someone who masters these skills and developes the patience to do so in the aid of their team (defending in CTF) deserves the right to call themselves a paintball sniper. NOT a freaking marine corps sniper, a PAINTBALL sniper, or stealthy sharp shooter.

Where's OS and/or Darur...

im thinken sombody is gunna get stabbed in this..., i believe in a certain form of the "sniper" in paintball but i dont wanna get into this argument, sooo ya...