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Sniping in Paintball

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HITMAN 4 HIRE View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HITMAN 4 HIRE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2005 at 12:10pm
theres sniping in paintball get over it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2005 at 4:36pm
Originally posted by HITMAN 4 HIRE HITMAN 4 HIRE wrote:

theres sniping in paintball get over it.


Prove it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nickodemus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2005 at 11:19pm

Originally posted by Darur Darur wrote:

Originally posted by HITMAN 4 HIRE HITMAN 4 HIRE wrote:

theres sniping in paintball get over it.


Prove it

I guess everyone has there decided definition of Snipers and Sniping. It just seems that the paintball snipers don't care about the skills that everyone else in the world's definition of sniper holds.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sniperdaddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2005 at 12:06am
alot of you are missing the point.sniping is NOT staying in one spot picking off targets that only you can see. the only reason that i got my 98 flatline is because my imagine couldnt hit a brick wall. so for all of you out there who are confused about the whole point of sniping it is simply this: 1. really accurate gun
                               2.avoiding other players paintballs
                               and 3. moving around to get a better vantage point of your opponent

that sums it up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2005 at 12:35am
Originally posted by Sniperdaddy Sniperdaddy wrote:

alot of you are missing the point.sniping is NOT staying in one spot picking off targets that only you can see. the only reason that i got my 98 flatline is because my imagine couldnt hit a brick wall. so for all of you out there who are confused about the whole point of sniping it is simply this: 1. really accurate gun

Name one please

                    &nbs p;          2.avoiding other players paintballs

Gosh!  You think?!
                    &nbs p;          and 3. moving around to get a better vantage point of your opponent

So, do the rest of the woodsballers all shoot guns with curvey barrels, eyes closed while jumping in front of others shooting at them and staying in one spot?
that sums it up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hybrid-sniper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2005 at 1:18am

Originally posted by Darur Darur wrote:

Originally posted by Sniperdaddy Sniperdaddy wrote:

alot of you are missing the point.sniping is NOT staying in one spot picking off targets that only you can see. the only reason that i got my 98 flatline is because my imagine couldnt hit a brick wall. so for all of you out there who are confused about the whole point of sniping it is simply this: 1. really accurate gun

Name one please

                    &n bs p;          2.avoiding other players paintballs

Gosh!  You think?!
                    &n bs p;          and 3. moving around to get a better vantage point of your opponent

So, do the rest of the woodsballers all shoot guns with curvey barrels, eyes closed while jumping in front of others shooting at them and staying in one spot?
that sums it up

Yeah, that is about the worst arguement I have ever seen trying to prove their existence.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sentinelz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2005 at 2:35am
Originally posted by Nickodemus Nickodemus wrote:

Originally posted by Sentinelz Sentinelz wrote:

Originally posted by Darur Darur wrote:

Originally posted by Nickodemus Nickodemus wrote:

Sorry guys, but I am trying to put some useful info in this "sniper" thread. Call them scouts, it's not sniper/scout school that they train at for nothing. That's like saying your a seal but not a UDT.

I covered the basics of sight adjustment, now holding for wind:

This is guesswork but there are methods. Remember, your projectile is more vulnerable to wind near the end of it's travel. This is because down range the projectile is moving slower, and also the wind has been acting on it longer. Wind is usually never constant - if you are shooting 1000 yards it may push your projectile left for the first 200, then towards you for the next 50, then the wind will curl and go right for the rest of your projectiles travel. Remember, the wind sock by you was reading left, but the last part of travel and most significant distance covered the wind was right. I say it is guesswork because it will shift.

So, to accurately correct for wind you need to make a little chart of how many inches your projectile gets shifted at a given range with a given wind speed. For wind direction you only need to memorise these shifts at anolog clock directions 1:00, 2:00, and 3:00. I would put data for 5 knot, 10 knot, 15 knot, 20 knot, 25 knot, and 30 knot winds. Wind coming from 9:00 will have the same effect as wind coming from 3:00, it will just push the projectile in the opposite direction.

So if I go to shoot and see that a wind sock down by the target reads a 15 knot wind coming from 7:00. I have to look in my notes or remember what 15 knots shifts the projectile at 1:00, say it moves point of impact 3" left at this distance, then correct the direction for the shift that pushes opposite 1:00 (the 7:00 wind sock). My POI is going to be 3" right.

I thought about sharing some advanced skills like accounting for mirage, and trajectory changes when shooting through glass windows, but maybe another day.

 



Buddy, its a paintball.  If you can get the thing to stay straight for even 30 ft its a miracle.

Make all the charts and crap you want, it wont do you any good.

I could with about a 35-39 ft barrel with no porting and a messed up valve that sends out air continuously maybe...

Sight adjustment is the same for paintball markers (if you have sights), that is why I said "projectile" not "bullet" or "paintball". Also windage estimation. The difference is the low velocity and inconsistency of the paintballs. They don't go far, have huge amount of drop, and arn't accurate because they're not solid. Other then that, paintballs follow the same rules as any other low-speed projectile.

HOLY CRAP!!!! I just thought of a new paintball that might fly straight!

I need to do some estimates and math I'll be back....



Edited by Sentinelz
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nickodemus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2005 at 9:44am
Originally posted by Long Tr'ang Long Tr'ang wrote:

Originally posted by Nickodemus Nickodemus wrote:

I mean range estimation by using a mil scope or the width of your front site.

How I would employ your scouts in woodsball:

[waiting in ambush]

newbie: "When are they going to come over here"

Nick: "Don't worry, I sent two scouts that way to find them and bait them back"

...

newbie: "I hear markers shooting over there, that's behind our ambush"

Nick "Yeah, I guess they found them - Listen to all that, they are outnumbered, they are buying us time - forget this ambush we all need to move this way, now!"  

 



yes but todo that u need to know the size of somehting at or neer that range to do it succesfully

Correct. You can use the estimated height of a person downrange very well. Also, there are other tricks, a 20" sillouhette will dissapear behind the width of your front site on a M1 (unless you have match sights) at exactly 300 yards. So if your target's width is visable when you aim at it, it's less then 300 yards away, and if it is more narrow then your front sight, then that is a +300 yard shot. Laser range finders are awesome until they break or the batteries die. If you see a target off in the distance and you do not know the range, but have five Rifleman, get each to adjust their sights for the estimated range, then put a minor change on each of them so that when they open up at least one will hit. remember it is better to hit low then high. If your projectile hits air, you never see it. But if it kicks up a little dust when it hits ground, you can adjust your sights off that. "Whoever gets there with the mostest, fastest, wins."

Think and give them all you have from the beginning, and never weaken!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2005 at 5:48pm
Originally posted by Nickodemus Nickodemus wrote:

Originally posted by Long Tr'ang Long Tr'ang wrote:

Originally posted by Nickodemus Nickodemus wrote:

I mean range estimation by using a mil scope or the width of your front site.

How I would employ your scouts in woodsball:

[waiting in ambush]

newbie: "When are they going to come over here"

Nick: "Don't worry, I sent two scouts that way to find them and bait them back"

...

newbie: "I hear markers shooting over there, that's behind our ambush"

Nick "Yeah, I guess they found them - Listen to all that, they are outnumbered, they are buying us time - forget this ambush we all need to move this way, now!"  

 



yes but todo that u need to know the size of somehting at or neer that range to do it succesfully

Correct. You can use the estimated height of a person downrange very well. Also, there are other tricks, a 20" sillouhette will dissapear behind the width of your front site on a M1 (unless you have match sights) at exactly 300 yards. So if your target's width is visable when you aim at it, it's less then 300 yards away, and if it is more narrow then your front sight, then that is a +300 yard shot. Laser range finders are awesome until they break or the batteries die. If you see a target off in the distance and you do not know the range, but have five Rifleman, get each to adjust their sights for the estimated range, then put a minor change on each of them so that when they open up at least one will hit. remember it is better to hit low then high. If your projectile hits air, you never see it. But if it kicks up a little dust when it hits ground, you can adjust your sights off that. "Whoever gets there with the mostest, fastest, wins."



I think you need to start specifying that this applies to a real gun, not in paintball, otherwise you will have the sniper population reading this as "hey dat dude said we could be snip-er dudes!".
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MT. Vigilante Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2005 at 8:51pm

Don't the people in paintball who think thier snipers do that^ anyway?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MT. Vigilante Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2005 at 8:55pm

Originally posted by Sniperdaddy Sniperdaddy wrote:

alot of you are missing the point.sniping is NOT staying in one spot picking off targets that only you can see. the only reason that i got my 98 flatline is because my imagine couldnt hit a brick wall. so for all of you out there who are confused about the whole point of sniping it is simply this: 1. really accurate gun
                               2.avoiding other players paintballs
                               and 3. moving around to get a better vantage point of your opponent

that sums it up

So then by your definition, every woodsballer in the world is a "sniper."

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nickodemus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2005 at 9:08pm

I try to give them more credit then that, but with some of these forumers I may get suprised.

Range estimation with MOA and mil-dot recticle.

Most weapons either scoped or iron sighted are graduated in the MOAs. I explained a MOA earlier in this thread... now we will take it further for range estimation. Really easy if you have a scope with stadia lines of 1MOA:

[(size of object in inches) X 100]/size of object in MOAs = range in yards

Now if you don't have that fancy scope you can use your front sight also. First calculate the MOA width of your front sight:

21600/[(sight radius in inches X 2pie)/front sight width in inches)] = MOA

Now to use it for estimating range. Say you calculated your front sight to be 8MOA with the second equation I gave you. How far away is your target? You want to shoot at a target with a 20 inch torso and your sight blanks it out perfectly. Use the first equation I gave you.

[(20" torso) X 100]/8MOA = 250 yards

Now for the scopes with mil-dots! Mils (3.6" @ 100 yards, or 36" @ 1000 yards). 1mil = 3.438MOA

Remember when measuring the length of a target in mils to go from the center of the dot or hash mark to the center of the next one, not the edges. They are 1/4mil wide and 3/4 mil apart. Heres your equation:

[(size of object in yards) X 1000]/size of object in mils = range in yards

If a 6' man (2 yards) is 4 mils in your scope then he is exactly 500yds away. 2 X 1000/4 = 500

MOAs are 3.438x more precise then mils, but if your shooting a cannon at a building or vehichle use mils.

 

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nickodemus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 May 2005 at 9:26am

I took a photo for you all, so that you may see some common calibers:

http://img187.echo.cx/my.php?image=dsc001703fl.jpg

I will go from left to right. First is the 30-0-06, this is the smallest caliber I would shoot at 1000 yards. Next to that is the Win .308, this is a solid killer out to 500 yards. After that is the 7.62 x 39, this medium cartridge is what most of our troops get shot at them, and is comparable to our narrow flatter shooting .223 that is fired in the AR military rifles. This includes the AR-15 derivatives M-16 and M-4. The AR-10 has a Win .308 chambering. I wouldn't trust a 7.62 x 39 or .223 to have enough energy to be a one hit killer past 300 yards. All three of these rifle bullets in the photo are 7.62mm in diameter and considered .30 cal. On the other side of the paintball you get pistol bullets. I would not expect to do much with these past 100 yards. First is the .45 ACP and next to that is the .40 S&W. Both of the ones in the photo are hydra-shock hollow points, so they look a little bit shorter then the normal ball ammo. Right of those are the 9mm luger and .22L bullets. I consider the 9mm a cap gun bullet - people survive getting hit by these all the time so long as it avoids a critical organ. The .22L is a great cartridge for target practice. It is quiet, comfortable to shoot, and match grade ammo is cheap. Don't underestimate the .22L, the bullet is small and fast- here is a photo of my .22L rifle.

http://img187.echo.cx/my.php?image=dsc001736tb.jpg



Edited by Nickodemus
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ghost-Rider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 May 2005 at 10:47pm
Originally posted by Darur Darur wrote:

Originally posted by stratoaxe stratoaxe wrote:

I'm new to the forum, so I thought I'd open up a really nasty can of worms.

Not a wise move

I've read alot on this board that has to do with sniping. I wanted to give some idiot newbie input. I've been playing paintball for a couple of years, but I've always studied militaria. That's why I play. Sniping, despite common misconceptions, isn't one shot one kill, nor is it hiding in the woods. Those are basic military principles.

No buddy, thats woodsballer tactics

Sniping is a skill. I know a couple of ex-snipers.

If they are real military snipers they will tell you sniping in Paintball is bull poo

Snipers are trained to do many things at once-but most of the time they hide-usually directed at a single target. I'm afraid too many newbies, including me when I first grabbed a gun, start paintball fresh off the online video games like Delta Force, and plan on using those tactics in paintball. I got a serious lesson in getting beat the first time I played trying to snipe fellow player. What I learned is that to create the speed and distance in a paintball to snipe, it would almost have to be lethal. Therefore to be a "sniper" in paintball-assuming the definition of a sniper is not what does, but the skill in which he does it

Whats the skill?

-you would have to be an expert with your gun. The key to being a sniper is to stay hidden.

Buddy, you just told me that was a "military principle", not a sniper thing.

They teach you in the military to stay hidden at all costs. How many people in reality can actually take another player out without his locaion being compromised?

Depends on the player being shot.  Its not that hard you will find.

Sitting in a trench waiting for another player is an ambush. Staying hidden isn't sniping,

Make up your mind buddy.  You told me first staying hidden is a military thing not a sniper thing, then you told me its vital to being a sniper, not you are saying its not sniping.

it's called woodsball.

Hence my earilier point . . .

What would sniping be in paintball, then? In my opinion, sniping is going after one target, and taking that target out without being seen or heard from.

Thats all fine and dandy but if you search the topic we've shown it doesnt work.

As I said, I'm not an expert, I'm simply giving my humble imput on this discussion. I've hashed this out with my friends over and over, and from my little experience I've learned the hard way that sniping isn't only hard, in the average game it's near impossible.

More like is impossible

Yeah, that was a really long-winded rant, but I'd like to hear more from other players who've been out there alot longer than me as to whether sniping is a valid position in paintball, and different ideas on how to pull it off. I think there was another thread on this elsewhere, so sorry if I'm rehashing old arguments.



And Wrong forum buddy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nickodemus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 June 2005 at 7:38am

Since this thread is in the wrong area and on "snipers," I am thinking about pulling out the shooting info I put into it. I would modify it, add too it, then put it into the new players forum under the topic of aiming. I never went over the fundamentals of a steady shot that I assumed everyone had, so I would brief over that.

I would do it now, but don't have time... I know a lot of people do not see how this info relates to paintball. Maybe I should put it in T & O or leave it here? Those who are still reading this thread... should I let this info I typed slip into the unactive archive under the wrong topic because I was trying to prove a point?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote warwingsaw3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 June 2005 at 3:58pm

alright...  Yeah, you are in the wrong forum topic area thingy for your subject, but hey, what the heck.  You wanted to know if a sniper is a valid position in paintball?  Two words.  Heck yeah!  When I play woodsball...   wait a minute, heres my setup first:

Tippmann 98 Custom (black)
-Flatline with shroud  -Special Ops Air Through SAW Stock -Expansion Chamber -Dead On Double Trigger  -Response Trigger System  -A scope -a PMI remote coil -bi-pod system -and best of all, a halo hopper when I ramp it up to 17 bps (where allowed).

*cough, here we go again.  When I play woodsball, I play one of two things.  A sniper (covers the captain, or the leader).  Or, I play Saw gunner (the big dude who likes to shoot everything that gets in his way).  Your right, sniping isn't all hiding, but it is a valuable position to play in order to cover your teammates and take out other captains in scenario games.  Nice meeting ya!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote xxg-reaperxx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2005 at 1:40am
you cant honestly snipe in paintball, now with the right equipment you can practice sharpshooting type tactics, but you cant really snipe.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sentinelz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2005 at 1:58am

YEAH!!!1!!!one!!!shift+1!!! I get to use this again!!!1!!!one!!!shift+1!!!

snipaskillz1xn.jpg



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darur Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2005 at 3:11am
Originally posted by xxg-reaperxx xxg-reaperxx wrote:

you cant honestly snipe in paintball, now with the right equipment you can practice sharpshooting type tactics, but you cant really snipe.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sentinelz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2005 at 5:15am

I wonder Darur since you're obviously much smarter than me as I click that damn link everytime I see it... would the ball fly straight if it had chambers and X amount of paint in the chambers? I went off to do math a few days ago posted a few times and then forgot and then remembered and then later remembered I can't do math or algebra I can barely handle geometry...

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