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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Variable Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 April 2005 at 9:29pm
Originally posted by Zesty Zesty wrote:

Dude, you are so "nit-picky" it's not even funny....use your brain! Comparing a 4cyl with a v12 is kinda unfair, but I guess you think differently. 


My point is that on the street and on the track, cars are rarely ever organized by the numbers of cylinders they have.  That is just some lame excuse that I always hear from ricers.  If you don't like getting walked by a car with more cylinders then either mod up or get a car that was meant to be fast.

Originally posted by Zesty Zesty wrote:

Where did I ever say they were?! never, so shut your mouth and stop putting words in mine. But in reality, what is a "race car"? It's a car that you race. I've definitely seen Nissan Maximas racing(and winning!), so I guess now that you mention it, you could call them a (good)"race car"!


It depends on what your Maximas are racing and I really doubt they're going against true performance designed vehicles.  Its a damn sedan afterall (it runs 15s stock...right where some of the trucks are).  To simply say that because a car wins against some other car it is therefore a good race car is foolish.  Maximas have their place, but it is not on the strip or the track.


Originally posted by Zesty Zesty wrote:

Like I said, Rear-wheel drive! It's not meant to be a 9 second 1/4 miler! It's meant to be a 300HP, all-engine out of a V6, rear-wheel drive beast....it's meant to "get sideways" and nab hoes while looking like a pimp in your budget performance car!


Like I tried to tell you before, RWD is ideal for drag racing...I wonder why top fuel dragsters are RWD and not FWD?  Hmm...maybe its because FWD suffers from wheel-hop and therefore **edited**ty 60' times?  Read: Here and here.
Originally posted by Zesty Zesty wrote:


You are right about the SRT4 being FWD, but that doesn't change my point. The SRT4 is FWD, the 350Z is RWD. FWD cars have the engine of the car to hold them down and help them "hook up", while a RWD car is being pushed by the rear tires, so it has no engine weight to keep it gripping the road......which makes a FWD car better off the launch than a RWD car.


I already addressed this.

Originally posted by Zesy Zesy wrote:

I think your logic is flawed! Dbi is rolling a 300+HP FWD car...the 350Z is about 300 stock HP....so he is already in a more powerful car!

Then you add in the fact that he's FWD, and he is in a safer car that gets better take-offs.


No he doesn't, not by a long shot (not if his suspension is stock).  Its too bad that 350Zs don't put out 300hp either.  DBiBeau is not stock, he either has some awesome boltons or he ordered a stage 2 kit from MOPAR (this is probably the case).


Edited by Variable
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DBibeau855 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 April 2005 at 9:36pm
My brother took some parts out of the car and had them acid washed, gave it a more agresive power band, the suspension is not stock, coil overs, sway bars, strut bars. Suspension is not stock. There is also a better LSD.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Variable Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 April 2005 at 9:39pm
You're not still on the stock turbo are you?  Any 1/4 times?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DBibeau855 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 April 2005 at 9:42pm
Nope not stock turbo. There is a stage 3 turbo system in there. New intercooler and whatnot. But the HP aside, my favorite things on there are the HKS RFL blow off valve and the turbo timer.

No quarter mile times yet, im not taking it to the track any time soon, my brother wants to go with me when i do, so im going to have to take it down to florida, this weekend im gonna go to the race shop and take some pictures and post them. Its kinda neat, some of yall might get a kick out of it.

Edited by DBibeau855
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Variable Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 April 2005 at 9:47pm
Chrysler came up with some really good ideas when they designed the SRT-4, where else can you get a new turbo for your car that comes with a tuned computer and a warranty?  Now if GM would just offer head and cam packages with a warranty (I can do over 400rwhp with just headers and h/c).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DBibeau855 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 April 2005 at 9:50pm
Whats nice as well, right out of the factory, the car sounds beutiful. If you are talking about their staged kits, no one else does that, maybe NISMO, but im not sure, but im very proud of dodge. But if you want to talk chrysler, i like that roadster thing, and that exotic they just made. The thing has 4 turbochargers in it...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zesty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2005 at 8:42am
Varibale, this is from the forum you linked me to:

"well in drag racing, AWD owns the launch, while RWD overall in considered superior once you start pushing 4 digits in the hp department because of its top end and ease of repair and strengthening. FWD is a distant last in the drag scene. On highway pulls, RWD and FWD are just about even unless your once again pushing like 600hp and lose traction on a fwd going 60mph, then RWD, but they are about the same. AWD is a close 3rd in this category. When it comes to handling, it really depends. your average driver will say fwd because they are inexperienced, and FWD is the best for thier skills, once you see professionals tho its AWD on the dirt and generally RWD on the pavement (drifting around a 180 degree turn for example) In extreme conditions such as snow and mud for daily driving etc, AWD is king with FWD in second and RWD a very distant 3rd. "


I will give you that you are right on a lot of the things you say, but you try and make it seem like RWD has all the advantages.

I actually think you are incorrect in your assumptions...these guys are talking about 1000+HP vehicles! I am talking about more everyday driving type cars.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zesty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2005 at 9:08am
Originally posted by Variable Variable wrote:


My point is that on the street and on the track, cars are rarely ever
organized by the numbers of cylinders they have.  That is just
some lame excuse that I always hear from ricers.  If you don't
like getting walked by a car with more cylinders then either mod up or
get a car that was meant to be fast.
First things first....have you ever heard of a Nissan Skyline? 6 Cylinders and will take on anything double that! Sick AWD systems that is basically RWD until it needs torque to the other wheels...basically the best of both worlds, AWD/RWD). So, please take your Nissan, rice-rocket hating comments elsewhere. How is trying to race similar-sized engines a "lame excuse"? To me, that's the fairest way it should be. You sound a dude in his 454 that keeps on telling the guy in his Honda CRX,"C'Mon, it's a fair race."

When comparing similar-sized engines, Nissan is pretty hard to beat.
Originally posted by Variable Variable wrote:


It depends on what your Maximas are racing and I really doubt they're
going against true performance designed vehicles.  Its a damn
sedan afterall (it runs 15s stock...right where some of the trucks
are).  To simply say that because a car wins against some other
car it is therefore a good race car is foolish.  Maximas have
their place, but it is not on the strip or the track.
Exactly, and YOU ARE THE ONE who started flaming just because I made a comment about a Maxima racing! Get off your high-horse! I've seen Maximas racing Trans-Ams, and sometimes winning, most the times losing....like you said, it's a sedan! Just the fact that you can take your RICER v6 sedan out to the track and even hope to compete with a v8 "performance" domestic 2-door is saying something! But you seem to see something bad in the fact that a sedan is out racing against cars with bigger engines and less size.

The line about me calling the Max a good racecar was a joke, stop picking a fight with every comment I make! Seriously, you sound someone who got eaten up by a Nissan so you come here to bash me for showing the slightest support...you seem to have a hang up. But the fact is, it is a sedan that is made for transporting people in comfort...just the fact that it's out there running with these boys should make them wonder.

Either way, that's why Nissan offers the Sentra Spec-v, 240SX, 300ZX, 350Z, and Skyline.....so once you're done beating that Maxima with your engine that's 2X the displacement, you can step up tp the real Nissan challenge!



Originally posted by Variable Variable wrote:


Like I tried to tell you before, RWD is ideal for drag racing...I
wonder why top fuel dragsters are RWD and not FWD?  Hmm...maybe
its because FWD suffers from wheel-hop and therefore **edited**ty 60' times?  Read: Here and here. <span style="text-decoration: underline;"></span>
Actually, you are grossly generalizing! I quoted the actual forum you lined me to, and they don't agree with you! At least not to the lengths that you make it seem they would.

Originally posted by Variable Variable wrote:


I already addressed this.
Unfortunately, not throroughly or correctly enough....but the links you gave me were very informative. Thank you.

Originally posted by Variable Variable wrote:


No he doesn't, not by a long shot (not if his suspension is
stock).  Its too bad that 350Zs don't put out 300hp either. 
DBiBeau is not stock, he either has some awesome boltons or he ordered
a stage 2 kit from MOPAR (this is probably the case).
Actually, from the info I got on one of your links, they say that for cars under 1000HP, the FWD/RWD doesn't make as much a difference. I'm talking about cars I've actually driven, not these 1000+HP monsters!

"well in drag racing, AWD owns the launch, while RWD overall in considered superior once you start pushing 4 digits in the hp department because of its top end and ease of repair and strengthening. FWD is a distant last in the drag scene. On highway pulls, RWD and FWD are just about even unless your once again pushing like 600hp and lose traction on a fwd going 60mph, then RWD, but they are about the same. AWD is a close 3rd in this category. When it comes to handling, it really depends. your average driver will say fwd because they are inexperienced, and FWD is the best for thier skills, once you see professionals tho its AWD on the dirt and generally RWD on the pavement (drifting around a 180 degree turn for example) In extreme conditions such as snow and mud for daily driving etc, AWD is king with FWD in second and RWD a very distant 3rd. "

So while I see your point about RWD being better than I'd made it out to be, you overstate it's effectiveness greatly....it's not the be-all, end-all. Nor is it the "best".

And just FYI, I know you're a hater, but the new 350Z is indeed 300HP and about 280torque....all VQ-series, V6 engine!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zesty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2005 at 9:11am
I see where you are right, and you are wrong. You have taughe some things so I respect you for that, even if you are a Nissan hater!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Variable Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2005 at 6:11pm
I never heralded RWD as the overall best drivetrain configuration, only that it is the most balanced when racing from a stop.  AWD cars can't cut the awesome 60' times they are famous for without doing a clutch dump near redline or else the wheels bog (EVO and WRX drivers are notorious for this tactic).  Also, parasitic power loss approaches 25% in an AWD vehicle compared to the usually ~15% for a manual RWD vehicle.  They fly out of a hole pretty fast but around 60 or so they begin to run out of steam.

Wheel hop is a major problem for FWD cars even when they don't make 1000whp/tq.  If the SRT-4s had RWD they could probably shave a few more tenths off their ET.

Also stock for stock, the LS1 absolutely destroys the Spec V and 240sx, rapes a 300zx, and still walks the 350Zs.  Modification for modification it only gets worse.  It is hard to do a thorough comparison with the Skylines since not all of them can be driven in the U.S. without spending tons of money getting it converted.  Most skylines aren't a problem for me except for the R34 (which is one hell of a car), but I'm almost positive it has to undergo almost $40,000 in conversions to be street legal in the U.S. 

    My attack on the Maxima stemmed from how some people love to analyze sedans and hype them up as supercars, but maybe they are only exclusive to the area where I live (I get it from about 3 people on a daily basis).  I see that this wasn't the case with you and I apologize.  I also don't doubt that there are some Maximas that can take on an F-body, there is almost one car of every model that is running a 10 second 1/4 mile and sometimes less.  I'll never forget the time when I watched Civic hatchback walk a Viper.


Edited by Variable
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JBird33 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2005 at 6:38pm
My LT1 Camaro will walk away from a 350Z, let alone an LS1...350Zs are overrated. And FWD is horrible for drag racing, I have the experience to prove it. I ran my Camaro at the drags here just a couple of weeks ago; I'm a bit of a car freak. 12 grand for an LT1 WS6 seems kinda high, I only paid 11 for my 97 and it had 24,000 on it when I got it. Oh well, all to their own.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Crimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2005 at 6:57pm
My dad just bought a 2002 Chevy Avalanche Z66, they are sweet. I am 15 and my parents bought me a 1997 Jeep Wranlger Sahara with 167,998 miles for $5,500. Its fun to drive but is slow. My best friend got a 350Z, they are fast but when put up against a real american muscle car, they suck. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BearClaw Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2005 at 7:12pm

Ahhh the welth of Automotive Unknologable people lol. 

RWD IS WAY better for take off that a FWD of ANY HP PERIOD.

Heck i got a FWD VW GOLF diesel pumps a pathetic 50hp but its easy (dont even need to floor it) to brake the tires loose.  Now i also have 230hp+ in my RWD pick up and REALLY gotta push it to just get the tires to even squak and its got NO wait in the back.

To explain the reasoning behinde this is Simple.  Its called WEIGHT TRANSFER.  When you hit the accelerator on your car (no matter what Drive or HP) you get pushed BACK into you seat (assuming your driving in forward gear lol).  Well JUST like you the vehicals weight is Shifted towards the rear of the vehical and the vehical Lurches (rear sinks and the nose rasies up.  This EFFECTIVLY places MORE traction to the rear wheels.  A FWD vehical would actually LOSE ALOT of traction due to this SAME Transfer of weight.

I consider myself fairly auto knolageable as i am a Mehcanic for a living. 

Now i not gona get in on the debate on witch car wound win what or what can be fixed up to do what BUT i will say that there are MANY more factors in WINNING a race than simply the vehicals Power and einge.  Dont forget the gearing, tires, weight, drive type, and even simply the weather conditions.

P.S. And you CAN get anything to win a race i got a Vid of a 6200lbs Diesel pickup running a 11sec quarter mile and have seen a few vids of others hitting mid to high 10s.



Edited by BearClaw
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JBird33 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2005 at 8:26pm
Yep. RWD rules
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