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What’s the deal with Bush??

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Clark Kent View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clark Kent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 12:14pm
Originally posted by Tae Kwon Do Tae Kwon Do wrote:

Originally posted by Clark Kent Clark Kent wrote:

and people are talking about Barack Obama, although 08 seems a little early for him. 

I would (and in '08 can ) vote for Obama for president. I would also vote for McCain for president.

Another up-and-comer to watch is Bobby Jindal.  He's a little further away, but is definitely going places as well.

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Slimz.357 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Slimz.357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 12:22pm

Squirrel: America's National Debt has been in the trillions for close to a century. We DID NOT have a surplus before Bush's term, and our eceonomy, (in addition to being on the rise) is the envy of the entire world.Economicly speaking, we are the most powerful nation on this planet, and have been for years.

The Unemployment rate is known universally to be a laging indicator in reguards to the state of the economy. Meaning the unemployment rates now are the result of things that happend 2-5 years ago. The fact the employment is on the rise has almost nothing to do with our Men and Women in the armed forces, it is being caused by Bush's economic policies.
The recent recession was primarily caused by 9/11 and the actions of the Clinton administration, which arwe both things the current administration has little control over.

As you said, the list could go on, but I think the point has been made.

I'm leaving now.



Edited by Slimz.357
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E-98 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote E-98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 12:29pm

Originally posted by RockinPorsche RockinPorsche wrote:

I don't like Bush because he put the country in the biggest financial deficit we've ever seen.
What about going into a war, and having the single largest terrorist attack on U.S. soil occur do you not understand?  The manufacture of ammunition, and the fuel that we use getting everything over-seas costs a LOT of money.
And this was during war time. Look at the past, war time got us out of finacial trouble, no into it.
The manufacture of rifles, ammunition, kevlar, armored and unarmored vehichles is expensive.  Sometimes this money goes to contractors, which boosts the economy.  All of this money to pay for these items comes from the government.  It boosts the economy, not the government's coffers dude.
I also don't like that he's using his religion as a basis for his ideas on how to run the country, not everyone is catholic like you, George.
Didn't know he was Catholic.  Some like the country being run on Christian principles, others don't.  It's a matter of opinion... so I'll stay out of this one.
Another thing I don't like is how divided he made this country. If he really loved America, I think he should atleast try to please everyone, instead of dividing us.
He didn't really divide us.  The country being 'divided' is mostly the cause of the Democratic propoganda that they like to spew out of every orriface in their bodies.

Originally posted by Psych0Squirrel Psych0Squirrel wrote:

First of all, I do like the man on a personal level. I have never met him but he does come off to be an arrogent idiot. Second, what about the economy. the unemployment rate has skyrocketed since he took office, He's made our country into the laughing stock of the world, He has made our country a FINACIAL LIABILITY to the rest of the world.
First off, the unemployment rate skyrocketed because of the terrorist attacks on the world trade centers.
He enters office with a surplus and now we are TRILLIONS of dollars in debt.
The manufacture of rifles, ammunition, kevlar, armored and unarmored vehichles is expensive. The economy goes in the toilet, which means less tax revenue.  Why did the economy go in the toilet?  Those gaping holes in our National Security left by clinton.
He has shed innocent blood. The patriot act...Maybe the employment rate has gone up buts its because there are so many people "working" in Iraq (**GOD BLESS THEM**). 
All the people in Iraq...  That bush sent over there?  zOmG1!1!!!1!  If I wanted to I could now say that he has helped the economy by going to war with Iraq.  Shed innocent blood, could you elaborate on that?
On the Iraq subject, can some PLEASE point out the link between Al Quida and Iraq, besides the amount of OIL.
There were terrorist training camps.  I don't give a damn who they belong to though.
Sure we got Saddam, he wasn't a threat...the real threat Usama, is still running loose because most of our troops are in Iraq trying to get the country under control.
Of course.  The dictator of a country who is trying to spew information about how he has WMDs is not a threat.  What happens when we kill [SIC] Usama?  Someone else takes the reigns?

My list can go on and on, but I do not have the time to go through them all. Yes I know there are people who like him and thats your thing. I do not like him. My last point I will bring up will probabally raise the biggest countroversy. Bush, is a TERRORIST. I wrote a paper on the subject and he fits the definition the GOVERNMENT DEFINED. He should be tried as a terrorist.
Let's see that defenition.

Now that I have surely steamed some of you, or just plain pissed you off I will say that I love my country, I just dispise the leader.

I also am against the war, but I still support our troops. GOD BLESS THEM. Your commitment to this country is god-like, and every one shall be eternally greatfull.

Well, I've finished my rant...
LEIK!  ME TOO!!

Ok.

I'm going to hide in my bomb shelter now.  : )

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E-98 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote E-98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 12:31pm
Originally posted by Slimz.357 Slimz.357 wrote:

Squirrel: America's National Debt has been in the trillions for close to a century. We DID NOT have a surplus before Bush's term, and our eceonomy, (in addition to being on the rise) is the envy of the entire world.Economicly speaking, we are the most powerful nation on this planet, and have been for years.

The Unemployment rate is known universally to be a laging indicator in reguards to the state of the economy. Meaning the unemployment rates now are the result of things that happend 2-5 years ago. The fact the employment is on the rise has almost nothing to do with our Men and Women in the armed forces, it is being caused by Bush's economic policies.
The recent recession was primarily caused by 9/11 and the actions of the Clinton administration, which arwe both things the current administration has little control over.

As you said, the list could go on, but I think the point has been made.

I'm leaving now.

Man, you said that so much better than I ever could have

Originally posted by Psych0Squirrel Psych0Squirrel wrote:

Have you not seen the numbers on the national debt? We are $7.6 TRILLION in debt (http://www.publicdebt.treas.gov/opd/opdpenny.htm). If you don't think that is a liability to the world, then what is? Where does that money come from? Other countries...

And don't call me kid...

Ok kid, so how does that money come from other countries?  I thought it came from taxes.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote metalpunx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 12:39pm
Man slimz ive been telling people that for years and its a concept they just cant seem to grasp (because it points a figure at there beloved adloterer). Thats a great coment about history class thou because thats where the majority of my beliefs come from not ideal but an example of what works and what walks. Dont get me wrong i dont belive everything they told us in school my political science class was a great example of that. Before that class i considerd my self a democrat with morals (aka prolife anti **edited** agenda ect.ect (not anti-**edited** i dont hate you for being **edited** i just think youn need help but i love you anyway just not in a **edited** way)). After listening to that teacher and watching all the students lap up whatever he had to say i couldnt belive it. This guy was ultra liberal i mean so liberal made hitler sound resonible. After he went on and on andb on i relized i am conservative not because i dont want people to help eachother out but becasue just like education to be effective you have to work on a smaller scale.
I'm sorry your opinion is WRONG! Every one who is not me is wrong!
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Clark Kent View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clark Kent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 12:50pm

Originally posted by E-98 E-98 wrote:

Ok kid, so how does that money come from other countries?  I thought it came from taxes.

If it came through taxes, it wouldn't be debt.

Debt is borrowed money.  The US government borrows money by way way of treasury bonds, which are bought by whomever (Americans and foreigners, but mostly corporate entities), and by direct loans from other governments.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brunse Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 12:55pm

Hey, before anybody says that the tax breaks are for the rich, you are definitely wrong. Ever since Bush lowered taxes it took off about one thousand of my fathers tax. My father owns his own business and each tax year, pays about $30,000. That's probably 5 to 10 times more than most of you. Also, when it comes time to get a refund. What refund? hey gets about $600 dollars back. To hear you guys (liberals) complaining, makes me angry. Why don't you stop complaining and start working because millions of welfares depend on you.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dune Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 1:13pm
Yes, because all welfare cases are liberals. I have seen ignorance in posts, but this liberal bashing and blaming them for "dividing the country" is beyond ignorant. I thought it was funny to see someone actually use the Trickle Down Theory to explain how Clinton messed up our economics, but to top it all off with the liberals dividing the country themselves and the liberals not working, this thread became a huge joke.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote duckncover21 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 1:27pm

Well everyone knows that you dont feel the effects of a president untill after his first term. Bush's first term was just the after shock of Clinton's last. Maybe if he would have thought about the nation more than getting his (u know what) sucked by Monica then we wouldnt have had problems.

Most idiotic statement in a century...  "I did not have sex with that woman!!"



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Clark Kent View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clark Kent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 2:43pm

Given the thread, it is perhaps not surprising, but still saddening to see how quickly we are backsliding into partisan bickering.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fatman Lash Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 2:50pm

The problem with debates is no one will ever change the way they see it. Alot of people are saying things based on what there parents tell them. "Our country is in debt and its Bushs fault"

........... You sure about that? I remember being in debt while Clinton was in office and no one complained then. The reason people bash on Liberals is because they find something new to complain about every day. Were in debt, were at war, Clintons sleeping around again, Bush is a hick, I wear womens underwear................. When will it end. Show me one Liberal who doesnt complain about a conservative and Ill give him a hug


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Clark Kent View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clark Kent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 2:56pm

Originally posted by Fatman Lash Fatman Lash wrote:

The problem with debates is no one will ever change the way they see it.

That's only true for narrow-minded fools.  I, for one, change my mind frequently in response to new information and good discussion.

Quote Alot of people are saying things based on what there parents tell them.

Certainly true.

Quote "Our country is in debt and its Bushs fault"

........... You sure about that? I remember being in debt while Clinton was in office and no one complained then.

I think the point being that we had a budget surplus during Clinton's term, and now we have a record deficit.  Under Clinton we were reducing the debt; now we are increasing the debt.  Many people confuse annual surplus/deficit numbers with overall debt numbers.

Quote The reason people bash on Liberals is because they find something new to complain about every day. Were in debt, were at war, Clintons sleeping around again, Bush is a hick, I wear womens underwear................. When will it end.

Much like conservatives complain all the time, just like you are doing right now.  Complaining is the exclusive domain of no single group.  During the Clinton years Replublicans were complaining non-stop - heck, Replublicans are STILL complaining about Clinton, several years later.

Quote Show me one Liberal who doesnt complain about a conservative and Ill give him a hug

The levels of partisan prejudice in that statement are staggering.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldsoldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 3:02pm
I am shocked, did I miss my copy of the latest DNC talking points memo, the same rants, the same unsubstantiated rumors, the same retoric.

Blaming an individual for the entire countrys ills, where congressional pork, and all the other mismanagement skills throughout the government is the fault of one man. Explain Kennedy, Boxer, and other long entrenched lawmakers excesses, pork barrel perks, congress determines our spending if I read the constitution correctly.

Lets see Democrats held the purse strings for education for over 40 years, and only now is the crisis caused by Bush. And in his four years all these buildings became obsolete, unsafe and too small. The NEA if I remmember is a Democratic leaning group, and these problems never exsisted in previous administrations, OK.........

Lets see the mass exodus of our core industries overseas (usually a result of high taxation) only began once Bush got into office. Sure we can believe that....

The same information the Democrats as well as Clinton gave America on Iraqi WMD's and the threat of Saddam, years before Bush came to office is now forgotten and it is only Bush who "lied".

If I remmember correctly the economic ballon burst (according to Wall Street Journal)in June 2000, long before the Bush administration economic policies came into effect.

Yep a single man personally is destroying America, it is his personal agenda, intentional, planned and orchestrated in the dark rooms of the Bush ranch.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MROD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 3:06pm

Most of those things are viable things to complain about. We are at war. At war with the wrong country, for that matter. And if we're not out of there in 5 years and a Civil war has broken out, guess where my ass is heading. Bush is a hick. No doubt about that. But that's no reason to poo yourself. We are in debt. With all these tax breaks hes giving people now, my generation will be paying for it later.

To the person who said he was Catholic: He's not, he's Born again (if they spell that differently at least you get the point). According to a show i watched on the History channel or somtrhing that's thee reason he won in the first place. He won the evangelicals.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clark Kent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 3:12pm

Originally posted by oldsoldier oldsoldier wrote:

Blaming an individual for the entire countrys ills, where congressional pork, and all the other mismanagement skills throughout the government is the fault of one man.

I concur that it is incorrect to blame the President 100% for problems on his watch, just as it is incorrect to give the President 100% of the credit for good things on his watch.

Things change slowly over time, and there are a myriad of interacting factors.  The fact is that economists do not know exactly what effect any given event (law, invention, war, tax policy) has on the economy - they cannot know.  Their guesses are more educated than ours, but they still cannot agree amongst themselves on most issues.

To say that "the economy is in the crapper because of Bush" is just as incorrect as to say that "the economy is on the upswing because of Bush's tax cuts".  Both are mere speculation.

Neither party is out to get us or intentionally run us into the ground - I am confident that everybody wants a strong economy.  If we knew for sure what the answer was, we would be doing it.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clark Kent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 3:16pm

Originally posted by MROD MROD wrote:

We are in debt. With all these tax breaks hes giving people now, my generation will be paying for it later.

That is your opinion, and the opinion of many.  Many others, however, including some very smart people, believe that cutting taxes, while painful in the short term, will help the economy in the long term, which may help your generation.  We will probably never know.

Quote According to a show i watched on the History channel or somtrhing that's thee reason he won in the first place. He won the evangelicals.

Also speculation (by the History Channel).  One article says it was g-a-y marriage and evangelicals.  Another says it was Iraq.  Another says it was a better haircut, and others say it was the security moms.

People like to present their speculation as fact, but that doesn't make it so.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DBibeau855 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 3:27pm
As much as I hate to say it. Colin Powel most likely will not run in 08. I would deffinetly vote for him. But with political mudslinging going on. His wife would be in the spotlight. Nice lady, but she has been in an out of psych wards her whole life. And he is a devoted husband he just wants to take care of her right now. I dont think he will run.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PAINTBALL1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 3:28pm
Ok well no president is perfect. If kerry was president then we would all be ranting about him and his dumbself. The way the economy is cannot be contributed to just one person. During War there is normally a time of recession, and then a high point. And also if you notice the times when the economy does the best is when you have a equal mix meaning: democratic president and mostly republican house and vice versa. ( Bush has a almost full house of republicans) , you can see this under clinton and the economy also did farely well during Regan's term. Bush all around isnt doing to bad of a job. Sure i dont agree with all of his policies but you know where hes headed. If bush says hes gonna do something he normally does. And its good to know where a president stands. The war is a complicated issue that non of us are ever going to have a full understanding of. Bush is doing the best he can for what he thinks is right for our country. The country is also not run in totallity (sp?) by the president, if you all remember in history class the system of checks and balances, the president does not have full control and seems more or less the bearer of news once everyone has decided upon something. My feeling is there just isnt a good mix of democrats and republicans in gov't. And by the way whoever said bush was a catholic is a complete moron...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dune Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 3:41pm

Apparantly liberals are the only ones that complain. I see OS do nothing but complain about "liberal" media, and everything else with the word liberal in it, yet nothing is said. It's pretty sickening, the lack of intelligence shown by both sides, especially lately. I applaud people that actually show points, not ones that are still mad at Clinton lying about his privacy and those mad because Bush cannot speak articulately. For all intents and purposes, the thread started out at least somewhat educational, and then just became a flame fest for those needing a defense mechanism.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DarkMachine5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2005 at 3:58pm
THEY TOOK OUR JERBS!!!!!!!!!!

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