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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RenegadeGopher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:38pm
(Directs reader to previous post made by Gopher..)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VisionIMP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:39pm

dude he clearly said CHRISTIANS. Im not tryin to convince any of you, i already know that you wont listen.

Proof that its all irrelevant. Apparently anything against christianity is irrelevant. Cause you guys dont wanna hear it, makes it wrong. What makes you think anything you say is right? You cant prove to me anything in the bible is true, or that God exsists. Ive been pressured more times in one day to become christian than anyone can imagine. Yes, ive had 4 calls in one day from the church of jesus christ trying to send me a video and all this crap. One of them even said Jesus loves Hitler. How messed up is that? I was also personally insulted by one of these god boys. So dont come off as some righteos person who thinks they know what they are talking about.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VisionIMP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:40pm
Originally posted by AdmiralSenn AdmiralSenn wrote:

Originally posted by VisionIMP VisionIMP wrote:

The matter of fact is that the bible is still based on greed and money. Thats why they did that. And it wasnt hundreds of years, a lot less.



Try reading up on history. The stories in the Bible were mostly finished by about 100 AD, and the indulgences happened many hundreds of years later. The Bible had nothing to do with greed and money.

I took a world religiouns class in my high school last year, got A's, you still gonna tell me im wrong? The bible was not finish around 100 ad. The last book wasnt finished until the mid 1800's.



Edited by VisionIMP
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdmiralSenn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:40pm
Originally posted by Enos Shenk Enos Shenk wrote:

You can make a convincing argument that religion is nothing more then a
type of meme virus, people get it, pass it around, and collectively try
to eliminate all the other religions.

Organized religion is a crock of steaming poo. Believe what you believe, listen to YOURSELF not some jumped-up preacher.



Organized religion in the sense of having a pope and stuff is very dumb.

At least do some investigating yourself before blindly following something. Don't just assume that you have to kiss some guy's ring because he said so.

I prefer organized religion in the sense that everyone knows what they believe, but they aren't forced or scared into anything.
Is God real? You'll find out when you die.

Okay, I don't have a clever signature zinger. So sue me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RenegadeGopher Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:41pm
....(/me reads the above posts..) Wow. Funky's right again...(CountIt)

Edited by RenegadeGopher
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Enos Shenk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:42pm
Originally posted by AdmiralSenn AdmiralSenn wrote:

Originally posted by Enos Shenk Enos Shenk wrote:

You can make a convincing argument that religion is nothing more then a
type of meme virus, people get it, pass it around, and collectively try
to eliminate all the other religions.

Organized religion is a crock of steaming poo. Believe what you believe, listen to YOURSELF not some jumped-up preacher.



Organized religion in the sense of having a pope and stuff is very dumb.

At least do some investigating yourself before blindly following something. Don't just assume that you have to kiss some guy's ring because he said so.

I prefer organized religion in the sense that everyone knows what they believe, but they aren't forced or scared into anything.


I prefer religion in the sense that ive developed my own beliefs, i dont feel the need to mercilessly annoy the hell out of random other people with my beliefs, and i could give a crap if anyone else thinks the same way.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdmiralSenn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:42pm
Originally posted by VisionIMP VisionIMP wrote:

Originally posted by AdmiralSenn AdmiralSenn wrote:

Originally posted by VisionIMP VisionIMP wrote:


The matter of fact is that the bible is still based on greed and money. Thats why they did that. And it wasnt hundreds of years, a lot less.


Try reading up on history. The stories in the Bible were mostly finished by about 100 AD, and the indulgences happened many hundreds of years later. The Bible had nothing to do with greed and money.


I took a world religiouns class in my high school last year, got A's, you still gonna tell me im wrong? The bible was not finish around 100 ad. The last book wasnt finished until the mid 1800's.



I took a world history class last year. We wenr into very specific detail on the evolution of Christianity.

The last book was finished long before the mid 1800's. That's Civil War times.
Is God real? You'll find out when you die.

Okay, I don't have a clever signature zinger. So sue me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote -ProDigY- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:44pm
Originally posted by tippy_182 tippy_182 wrote:


Originally posted by -ProDigY- -ProDigY- wrote:

Yeah, nothing like two straight hours of
guilting you into
religion.

Exactly.  Even prodigy trying to throw an insult proved a point I'm trying
to make.
Try watching the movie and see if you don't feel guilty.
I sure did.  And I should.
I made him go through every single minute of it.  He didn't just
do it for me.  He did it for everyone.  Including you Prodigy.
He's not forcing anyone to believe in him.  Thats your choice nad
he leaves it up to you.  But I'm guessing since you felt guilty
hes already dealt with your heart.  I know it sure touched mine.


You will never change my mind about religion, and i will never
change your mind about religion.
This is how i feel about the subject at hand. I feel 100% certain that my
beliefs are correct, just as you may be 100% certain that your beliefs
are correct.

We are organisms. We're no different, as far as purpose is concerned,
than any other organism. Now, purpose, as i see it, is largely what
Christianity addresses. "Why are we here"? Christianity provides a quick,
easy answer to that question. "To serve God, of course"! It would be nice
if it were that cut and dry, but it's not. At all.
The teachings of Christianity are good. (For the most part) They teach
love, and attempt to help you lead a better life.
Chrstianity, however, plays off of your fears in order to get these
messages across to people.
Death is inevitable. Death is also a mystery. When you know, for a
fact, that something as HUGE and AWESOME as death is going to
occur, but you have no idea what it really involves it is
extremely scary. It's no suprise, with that in mind, that religion,
which plays off of these fears, was created in the first place and
continues to flourish.

I, however, can accept that we're likely here for no reason at all.
We're here. To strive as well as we can, exist, and eventually die off. No
different than a plant or virus. I can also accept that maybe there is a
larger plan for us, and maybe, for some unknown reason we're all here on
purpose.
I can accept that i may never know.
I refuse, however, to buy into a false god that plays off of my fears and
uncertainties.

Argue with me, pick my post apart, what have you.... I love a good
argument. We've already established we're not going to be changing any
minds here..... I just thought i'd let you know how i feel.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdmiralSenn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:46pm
Originally posted by VisionIMP VisionIMP wrote:

dude he clearly said CHRISTIANS. Im not tryin to convince any of you, i already know that you wont listen.


Proof that its all irrelevant. Apparently anything against christianity is irrelevant. Cause you guys dont wanna hear it, makes it wrong. What makes you think anything you say is right? You cant prove to me anything in the bible is true, or that God exsists. Ive been pressured more times in one day to become christian than anyone can imagine. Yes, ive had 4 calls in one day from the church of jesus christ trying to send me a video and all this crap. One of them even said Jesus loves Hitler. How messed up is that? I was also personally insulted by one of these god boys. So dont come off as some righteos person who thinks they know what they are talking about.



Again, you are stating things that aren't true. Other religions aren't irrelevant, just wrong (from a Christian's point of view, before you start on that too).

I can prove that things in the Bible are true. They are recorded in dozens of outside sources with the same stories.

I'm sorry that people bothered you. There are lunatics in all causes.

Don't expect a Christian to be perfect. Read my sig. People screw up. I screw up.

I'm not trying to come off as anything. I read the Bible, I study it, I try to understand it. I don't claim to be the authority on anything. I just know what I know and think what I think. I don't care what you think of me.
Is God real? You'll find out when you die.

Okay, I don't have a clever signature zinger. So sue me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:48pm


Deus Meus! Securis in capite meo est!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdmiralSenn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:48pm
Originally posted by -ProDigY- -ProDigY- wrote:

(Really long quote in center orientation)


Heh. Fears? I'm not scared to die; never have been. Even before I got "into" Christianity, I never was scared to die. If we have no purpose and there is no God, then we die. Whoopy.

I don't think there are that many people that are Christians because they're scared to die.

Edited by AdmiralSenn
Is God real? You'll find out when you die.

Okay, I don't have a clever signature zinger. So sue me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frozen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 September 2004 at 11:51pm
Originally posted by patrick patrick wrote:



Deus Meus! Securis in capite meo est!


Meina guth, Ikgastaldan aqizi-wunds meina haubida!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AdmiralSenn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2004 at 12:08am
Anyway, it's 1:33 here. I'm going to sleep. If anyone (read: VisionIMP) wants to continue this, PM me. I don't see a need to let this escalate until it gets locked.
Is God real? You'll find out when you die.

Okay, I don't have a clever signature zinger. So sue me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote -ProDigY- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2004 at 12:09am
Originally posted by AdmiralSenn AdmiralSenn wrote:

Originally posted by -ProDigY- -ProDigY- wrote:

(Really long quote in center
orientation)


Heh. Fears? I'm not scared to die; never have been. Even before I got
"into" Christianity, I never was scared to die. If we have no purpose and
there is no God, then we die. Whoopy.

I don't think there are that many people that are Christians because
they're scared to die.


Are you denying that one main purpose of Christianity is to
answer the "big questions" of life? Because i think we both know that's
what i was suggesting. And i also think death falls neatly into that
category.

I thought you hung up your "religious debate" hat, Senn. Glad to see
you've reconsidered. We need at least one intelligent Christian to argue
with.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastside Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2004 at 6:43am

I took a world religiouns class in my high school last year, got A's, you still gonna tell me im wrong? The bible was not finish around 100 ad. The last book wasnt finished until the mid 1800's.

 

 

the mid 1800's?? the final book of the Bible is Revaltion, which was written by Paul while he was exiled to an island I can't think of the name too....more like 100 years after Christ died....not 1800 years

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ejp414 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2004 at 8:26am
People on both sides of this suck. The point isn't to insult Christianity or to insult any other religion. My point was exactly as AdmiralSenn stated it, I think it's sort of sad that so many need a movie to be reminded of their "faith".

Just because I said that I am atheist doesn't mean that I was putting forth the idea that God doesn't exist. I may think that, but when a Buddhist says he is Buddhist, do you become offended and try to defend your religion? If you do, then you're probably very insecure in your faith.

And, yes, The Unknown, I went to sleep, I would continue the debate with you in particular, except that I don't see any need to. I think any outside observer with an ounce of intellect would see exactly what was going on. However, I do think it would be interesting to see what random non-sensical response generator you're using--I don't think I've seen those before.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Jim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2004 at 8:31am

I'm gonna take a stab at this. I am a Bible believing Christian.(King James Version for those of you who might care.), and I've been a Christina since I was 7(Now 15). First off, I wanna look at the whole men inspired by God to write the Bible thing. Be prepared for a weird analogy, but this is the way I look at it. Do you know how a possesed person is possesed by demons? Well, when a Christian accepts Jesus as his Saviour he is possesed with the Holy Spirit. Now when a person is possesed by a deamon their thoughts and actions are usually completely controlled by it. Now, when the apostles(and anyone else who ever wrote in the Bible.) was completely filled with the Holy Spirit, therefore having a direct connection to God.(The trinity, Father, Son, and Holy spirit.) This means that God had complete control of their thoughts when they were writing, from which comes the God inspired, PHYSICALLY WRITTEN by men, Holy Bible.

About religion and people. To me religion is only what you make it. I personally don't believe Christianity is a religion. I believe it is having a personal relationship with God. Not doing so many so and so's and being at church every week.( although the latter part does help your Christian walk with God, as long is it is a Bible believing factual church). In conclusion, it's your decision, "I" personally believe that most people are gonna live to regret their decisions. I hope you won't.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ejp414 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2004 at 8:32am
Originally posted by Eastside Eastside wrote:

I took a world religiouns class in my high school last year, got A's, you still gonna tell me im wrong? The bible was not finish around 100 ad. The last book wasnt finished until the mid 1800's.

 

<>
the mid 1800's?? the final book of the Bible is Revaltion, which was written by Paul while he was exiled to an island I can't think of the name too....more like 100 years after Christ died....not 1800 years


Revelations was written by a man named John, more than likely the same John as the gospel writer. Oh, and if the Bible wasn't finished until the 1800's, then where did the term "Gutenberg Bible" come from?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WUNgUN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2004 at 8:44am
I think that some of you are misled by the concept of "fearing death". Its not necessarily the fear of dying and nothing happening, organized religion presents the fear of terrible things happening because of your "short-comings" in life, visa-a-vis "hell". Scare-tactics more or less. It is seen as a means/method of control by a certain ideology or belief system.
For others, especially the "have nots", death or "eternal life" may be seen or anticipated as a reward. It may even be something better than their life mortal life. So the opposition may point to what happens after your life has ended runs the gambit of control.

* Not my personal beliefs, but I have heard the argument presented in that manner.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frozen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 September 2004 at 8:47am
Originally posted by Ejp414 Ejp414 wrote:

Originally posted by Eastside Eastside wrote:

I took a world religiouns class in my high school last year, got A's, you still gonna tell me im wrong? The bible was not finish around 100 ad. The last book wasnt finished until the mid 1800's.

 

<>
the mid 1800's?? the final book of the Bible is Revaltion, which was written by Paul while he was exiled to an island I can't think of the name too....more like 100 years after Christ died....not 1800 years


Revelations was written by a man named John, more than likely the same John as the gospel writer. Oh, and if the Bible wasn't finished until the 1800's, then where did the term "Gutenberg Bible" come from?


Gutenburg made the first widely available bibles...in like the 1400's???
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